What did you ride before downhill and how does it affect your style now?

numerik · Mar 9, 2011

I rode my girlfriend...I'm smooth over rocks and low over jumps.

ebarker9 · Mar 9, 2011

Interesting topic. Rode XC growing up and still trying to get used to the capabilities and range of suspension adjustments of the DH bike after 3 seasons. I think kids now are better off for not knowing the terror of trying to descend on an aluminum hardtail, seat 10 feet in the air, V-brakes, and maybe a front shock with 1.5" of travel.

nelsonjm · Mar 9, 2011

I did nothing... just rode my bike to work through childhood and up till college.

Coincidentally, I am a hack.

Pslide · Mar 9, 2011

Been riding for 15 years. Started riding steep stuff, technical stuff, and fast stuff on XC bikes with 71 deg head angles and long stems. Naturally I had to hang off the back, which is still my tendency to this day. I have to work hard to get my weight central and over my front wheel. For this reason I've never been very good at drifting, and I had to re-learn how to corner. Am decent at reading terrain and carrying speed though. Pretty lame at big jumps and style in the air. Old habits are hard to kick. Can still get down the hill pretty quickly despite it all...

KavuRider · Mar 9, 2011

Cool topic!
I started out riding road actually, doing a few charity rides. Then cobbled together a rigid singlespeed and rode that on the local trails, to work, everywhere. Eventually put together a Kona Stinky with a Monster T and got into the whole early-2000 freeride "scene" (drops to flat, insanely heavy bikes, urban freeride, etc).

Never rode BMX, never rode Moto. I'd like to try both someday.

Most of the time I was riding trails though, especially climbing. Love climbing...

Scrub · Mar 9, 2011

BMX bike back in the 80's-90's. Competed in street/dirt and vert comps and a little racing. Those skills transferred over to DH and DS smoothly even after a 6 year hiatus off any type of bike.

chup29 · Mar 9, 2011

rode bikes for ages before i started dh - but i got directly into dh, spent way too much time riding groomed berms and jumps but at the same time, i learned in the short rough sections how to go flat out over rocks and roots and stuff - then i moved to ashland oregon and learned a different skill - outright speed... on a dh bike in ashland, your rarely under 20 miles an hour and usually going much much faster than that weaving in between trees and hitting natural corners and really natural trails along with some epic berm trails. so from going back and forth from california to oregon, i got really fast and that translated over to the race results. But, like the OP said, i can only manual for maybe 10-20 feet because it wasnt a skill i felt it was necessary to learn, rather learn how to get the power down in the most efficient way possible or be able to corner really well. I have friends that can manual for days though. so from my perspective, its really where you ride and the skills necessary for those riding spots that dictates much of your personal style.

Hesh To Steel · Mar 9, 2011

I only started riding in late 2007, and basically started riding because my friend and I heard about Diablo and thought it sounded like a lot of fun. as a result, I pretty much only rode DH, and still pretty much only ride DH. It's the most fun, and I don't have a ton of free time so I figure I'm not going to mess around with the less-fun types of riding.

My path to DH, such as it were, has just resulted in my being rather slow, since I'm still not just a beginner DHer, but a beginner cyclist in general.

Total Heckler · Mar 9, 2011

I started with bmx (dirt jumping, some street, and racing) when I was a kid, transferred to moto in my early teens, got VERY close to breaking my neck racing motocross, stopped everything until I was 20, got my first mtb and quickly realized I needed a downhill bike after riding my 5 inch bike like a full on dh bike.

I think my moto background helped the most with my current riding style.

IH8Rice · Mar 9, 2011

rode some XC from '96-'99 then got into DH since i hated going up hills. i primarily only rode at Platty, so the learning curve was a bit steep for me (pun intended).

WBC · Mar 9, 2011

I started out riding enduro motorcycles from basically age six until early college when I could no longer afford it. In late middle school I got into xc mtb as a way to lose weight for moto, but wound up getting really into both the northshore style scene and urban mtb freeride(oh god). I wasn't as into the skinny stuff, but idolized wade simmons (still do at 24, ha ha), so I tried to find nasty rock lines wherever I could. Once I got my license, I pretty much only rode freeride/dh in the woods. Steep rocks! Didn't get into dh in a racing sense til I was 21 ish, but did a few fun whistler races here and there.

That affected my riding by focusing my strengths on nasty, natural rocky tech lines and being able to ride that stuff fast. Also feeling comfortable going wide open on rough fast rocks, cornering, hanging on when I gotta monster truck some ****, etc. On the other side,my background has less jump influence, so relative to the rest of my riding, I still struggle with big jumps, style, especially steep jumps. If you watch my race runs, I'm fast through the tech and rough, but a dog through the jumps! I'd say I've got a pretty old school style!

I like this topic, too. Looking at yourself like this really heps to identify strengths, weaknesses!

Also, in regards to trail building, my trails are rough, tech, natural, and very primitive.

jon-boy · Mar 9, 2011

I too started riding hardtails with minimal travel, in fact my first two bikes were fully rigid until I gave in and got a Rock Shox Quadra21. 45mm of elastomer sprung travel. Nice. However all my early riding was in the UK, so very different terrain to what I ride now. All my rides with friends involved racing up hills but mostly racing down the hills too.

Anyway I rode/raced XC for a while, and also bombed around the woods playing in jumps and such like. I then got into a little bit of downhill around 2000 and then moved to BC where the riding skills had to take a very quick jump up. I had a FR bike to start, then got a DH bike for a while and then I'm just coming off of a 3/4 year gap of no DH bike and just picked one up 2nd hand. I've been riding a lot of AM for the past while, though here in BC AM is more like freeride in most spots. Ladders, drops, steep tech roots all that good stuff.

I'm technically strong but do lack a little bit of the ability to see lines and places where I can launch from and clear a tech section. (Generally due to the bike that I'm used to riding not appreciating such behaviour). That's coming though. I also tend to throw my weight too far back on steeps on the DH bike and am working on being more agressive with the bike in turns and such like. It's fun still learning after all this time.

One thing I'd say is that if you can, try to do a clinic with a coach. I did one with Eric Carter and Rich Houseman a few years back and it was a lot of fun and I learnt a bunch from them. Things I still remember are using more body language with the bike in turns, pedalling out of corners hard to bring the bike back on line and not dragging the back brake into a turn as it makes the bike was to stand up. Just shows that these tips do help and stay with you.

norbar · Mar 9, 2011

Wa-Aw said:
Thread title says it all: I'll start

I rode 8 years of XC/AM, just basically riding around the wood and everywhere. Started at about 12. This is the start of my 2nd season of actually being a downhiller. I only considered myself one when I started racing as pretty much everything before that I'd consider a hard AM trail.

Never did any BMX or moto, basically learned two wheels on the trails.

This seems to have given me inherent strength in technical riding and just basically weaving through single track and not hitting trees. Precision is something that just seems to come naturally. And naturally I consider myself decent at putting the power down.

But I find my distributions of strengths a bit funny as I'm competitive in pro DH here but I can hardly pull a manual or a wheelie for more than a few meters consistently. I also took quite some time getting used to going fast and staying fast, especially in the roughs. Also took (or is taking) me for ever to learn how to whip. Big jumps were and still kind of are quite challenging, but drops are a peace of cake no matter how gnarly the take off or the landing is.

Does anyone have similar experiences with their strengths in downhill coming from a trail riding / xc back ground?

I'm sure many of you have come from moto and bmx too, how has that affected your style?

I'm in the same place. Been racing xc since I was 9. Got a trailbike at 13 and rode it hard (well I still ride it but less hard now) till I was 17 when I got my first dh bike.
I've got the same problems as you for the most part.
I also feel really strange on the flats since I tried it this year for the first time in my life (well before I was 9 I tried it) but can pump the terrain really well.

I also used to put a lot of my weight to the back but I fought it through. Prefer steep and techy over fast and open courses.

fred.r · Mar 9, 2011

I was a pedi-cabber... that's honestly how I got back into bikes at age 20. Work all night, get up the next day and trail ride my roommates Gary Fisher Opie or my other roommates Banshee Scream. I would ride the Scream on XC trails around our house... then I finally found the DH spot here and that's when I got my own bike and started progressing.

demo 9 · Mar 9, 2011

BMX, makes me jump and pump everything, so im great in the berms and have all the jumps and tricks i could need, but the downside is that it made me a lazy fvck when it comes to pedaling for DH.

djjohnr · Mar 9, 2011

Lived on my bike as a kid but it got displaced by skateboards in my teens. Then in 97 I got a hardtail with 2" of front travel and started doing a lot of XC riding. Bought my first FS bike in 2001 (Titus Switchblade) and proceeded to try to drop it off everything in sight. Worked in the bike industry for a few years during the dot com bust and got into DH. I'd say riding DH on XC bikes originally taught me how to ride light through tech sections, which reflects how I tackles things currently.

rav400 · Mar 9, 2011

When I was little, rode my bike all the time. In high school started riding BMX and pretty much learned to ride at the South Park BMX track (one of the best in the world), and a few small jumps I built near my house. In college, there was a skatepark not far from campus, so I was there most Fridays. Also, the campus was out in the country and near some pretty awesome singletrack so later in college I started to get back into mountain biking. Trail riding that is, on my old rigid Cannondale XC bike which I've had since 6th grade.

Being a BMXer, I was looking to have fun on the mtb as well. So I took my old Cannondale to Snowshoe for the last monster park to check it out the trails and photograph the event. Snowshoe made me realize I needed a DH bike. After I graduated and went on for a second degree in the city, I had an internship so I actually had money. After hearing the local mountian (7 springs) opened a downhill park, I pieced together a used RM switch for the 2008 season and took to DH instantly thanks to years of BMX and a little trail riding.

OGRipper · Mar 9, 2011

Cool topic. Over the years I've ridden just about everything - except pedi-cabs. First got hooked riding BMX as a little grom in the dirt, then rode vert and flatland for years. Got a job in a bike shop when I was 14. Got my first mtb in the late 80's, a road bike not long after that. I haven't ridden a BMX in years but it remains the biggest influence. I'm always looking for stuff to pop off of and can't seem to hit a jump without throwing in at least a little bar turn.

And like other old farts I also tend to shift my weight back too much on the steep stuff.

Hesh To Steel · Mar 9, 2011

From talking to guys at the bike parks I've been to, it seems like the guys with BMX and MX backgrounds end up being fast on DH bikes pretty consistently.

That's not say that all fast DHers started off as BMX or MXers, but it seems like almost all BMX and MXers who come to DH end up being fast (after an acclimatization period).

demo 9 · Mar 9, 2011

I would agree with that, especially from mx, my BMX background helps me double up stuff, and i can rip a berm extremely well (compared to others in my experience) however, i am not very good at rocks (proportionally) BMX lets you rail berms, pump anything, and double up sections and whatnot (EX-doubling up the rollers at windham) However, you still have to start from "zero" with rock gardens and roots, im my experience.

rav400 · Mar 9, 2011

Definitly agree about the BMX advantage. I'm always looking for roots and rocks to pop off of. I love trying to jump a rock garden rather than plow through. However, riding pennsylvania singletrack a rigid has taught me to see lines through rock gardens and to stay loose, using my elbows and knees as suspension.

MinorThreat · Mar 9, 2011

I raced flat track, MX and desert hare-and-hound as a kid but couldn't afford it after going to college/getting married/having kids. When I got into mountain biking, XC quickly bored me; but then I discovered downhill - - and I was hooked. It felt like being on a dirt bike again.

I'm the skinny kid in the Bell full-face.

bdamschen · Mar 9, 2011

I think I might have been the only kid I knew who rode mountian bikes before BMX, since I grew up in BFE and there were plenty of trails but no bmx track. These days I think I'm still pretty smooth and light on my pedals from riding full rigid xc bikes with crappy xc tires and crappy (but light) wheels... To this day in the back of my head I still expect to get a gnarly pinch flat if come up a little short gapping small stuff or hit a rock too hard with my back wheel.

bpatterson6 · Mar 9, 2011

I started racing BMX back in 1977 in Austin, Tx. I raced BMX for 10yrs. Literally racing sometimes 7 times a week. Back then, I raced for some of the biggest companies in BMX. Mainly GT Bicycles. (I had #5 of the first 7 BMX frames that Gary Turner ever built) Myself and my other family involved in BMX had already ridden GT Frames for years & due to the fact that My dads brother Scott was the GT Factory BMX and Freestyle team manager for a few years and had a close relationship with Rich Long and Gary Turner I literally was able to get one of the first GT Mountain Bikes ever made. Around about 1983-84 GT Bicycles came out with the GT Backwoods Mountain Bike. I rode that mountain bike until the cranks literally fell off. I wish I still had it for nostalgic reasons. Scott later on worked with Bob Morales and expanded the AFA (American Freestyle Association). He and my aunt ran alot of Freestyle competitions all over the country. Some people from RM have PM'd me asking if I was related. I am.

From the fact that I raced BMX for so long it's pretty obvious that my abilities in the gated disciplines are where I Excel. I love 4x & Dual Slalom. I prefer 4x racing maybe because of my back ground. I have a pretty aggressive riding style. I really enjoy the contact of 4x. Most of my competitors will agree. I really love to ride Downhill, but I don't enjoy the racing aspect of it as much. I love the trail building aspect and the brotherhood of it all but I wouldn't call Downhill my strong suit. Alot of the skills do carry over and I find it easier to build on my technical skillset because of this. I'm a cat 1 rider but I'm almost never in the area of top 5. I'm a top 10 DH rider at best. I'm ok with that. This year I turn 40. I'm never gonna be pro. LOL. I race and ride bikes for one reason. FUN.

Dogboy · Mar 9, 2011

Started off riding BMX about 30 years ago. Mostly dirt jumping and a little racing when I could afford it. Did a little road racing as a junior in the mid-80's. Spent about twelve years riding skateboards, some competitions and rode BMX dirt and street a little bit. Got on a mountain bike in the early 90's and have been riding them in some form ever since. Did my first DH race about 6 years ago. These days I ride XC, dirt jump, road ride, do a full season of cross racing, and do 5 or 6 DH races a year. DH access isn't super convenient, so most of the time I'm riding XC or jumping/goofing off.

BikerBoy28 · Mar 9, 2011

I rode and raced MX before downhill and people always ask if I used to ride MX due to my "wild cowboy" style. Strengths of riding mx before dh is I'm very comfortable in the fast and rough and can rail corners like no ones business. I guess I've got a bit of a pinball danny hart style going on. Downsides, I cant pedal for sh*t!

Jim Mac · Mar 9, 2011

Like so many others here, I started in BMX in the 70's, first as a wanna be:

Then as a racer, early 80's: (I'm the fat kid on the right)

Then as a pseudo freestyler:

Then it all went to hell when Metallica came to town:

I sold my bike, got a car....People who ride behind me still say that I ride my bike as if it were a BMX. I still always look for things to jump, etc.

frango · Mar 9, 2011

Like so many other others

I started with recreational XC hardtail with rigid fork about 20 years ago. Then moved to HT with 2" MCU fork

Bikes started to get bigger, and bigger other the years and finally, in 2001 I bought my first DH bike - Santa Cruz S8 with Boxxer and ProStop brakes

So, 10 years of XC made me stay a bit too far at the rear end of the bike.

Deano · Mar 9, 2011

BMX urban riding back in the early 80s, a GT with plastic wheels.. then took a long 15 year break got back on a GT zaskar by accident via a friend, trying to be Hans Rey and bouncing and jumping and climbing everything in sight in the city..

So i guess its all influenced me in the way, im not racing fast, but i enjoy tech trails, wet roots and rocks more then most.

Mr Lahey · Mar 9, 2011

Mogul skiing and BMX.

Mogul skiing provided a lot in terms of vision, absorption, balanced body position, and ability to read a line.

BMX got me comfortable on a bike and home safe from a night of drinking while at school.

stoney · Mar 9, 2011

BMX through the 80's. MTB on a 40#, rigid, steel Schwin through the early-90's. Nothing from mid-90's until '99. Got a 4" AM bike, started racing DH within 6 months.
My riding style is very pump and jump.

slowitdown · Mar 9, 2011

This is one of the most relevant threads I've read here at RM. Beats the stuffing out of e-riding with gram-counting build discussions!

I grew up mostly in the DC suburbs, in MD. Started riding bicycles around age 5, was a chicken who wouldn't take off the training wheels... my grandfather made me take 'em off because it embarrassed him!

Started downhill/alpine skiing at age 7.

Started riding off-road motos at age 12 while living in Houston TX, first a Honda Trail 50 then a Kawasaki KX 90 (ages 13-17) then later... a Yamaha YZ250 (18-21).

When I was around 14 I was back in MD. I got a Schwinn krate bike for my birthday which I rode as a krate bike for about a year, then tore it down and put a 20" wheel and rigid fork on the front, removed all the gears, got a coaster singlecog rear wheel, and a "BMX kit" from the Zayre (like a KMart or Target) store up the street. The kit had struts to replace the looped "sissy bar" on the banana seat, and had a moto-style handlebar and direct-mount style stem. I used to take that sorta-BMX bike to the local woods and do time-trials on a descending trail, competing with friends.

Rode a "10-speed" throughout high school and quit riding bicycles after getting a driver's license. Got back into bicycles in 1985 after an ACL reconstruction, the orthopod suggested I take up cycling. Got a road bike and started riding/training with a friend who was training for triathlons. Was a half-serious roadie for several years, then got a MTB when I moved to a rural part of NJ (New Vernon) where many of the local roads were ****ty for road riding. Started riding MTB more seriously after moving back to MD and working with some guys who raced XC, they took me to Patapsco/Avalon a bunch. Moved back to NJ, Morristown this time, and began racing XC occasionally, mostly at Ringwood.

Moved to western Montana in '98 and started riding serious mountains on a 3" travel fork, hardtail bike. Got into the shore-stunt FR gig with a bunch of friends and slowly got bigger-travel bikes. Broke both shoulders. Broke a frame. Kept riding over my head!

I sold my last big-travel bike in 2006 and have been on 5" or 6" travel trail bikes since then. I've never raced DH because we don't have a DH race scene here, the nearest is Silver MT in ID or over in Spokane WA. But my riding is much more DH-racer style than anything else, I ride to descend, and I spend a lot of time watching World Cup DH race footage, learning how to do things by using the movement analysis I learned in alpine skiing.

My alpine skiing is very high-level and I have great terrain-reading, absorption, anticipation and line selection skills as a result. They translate perfectly to descending on a MTB. I'm old and so I don't try to take much air and I will ride around drops or jumps if they're even halfway big, but I'll ride any technical crap otherwise. I love super-rocky, super-rooty, rutty stuff that scares a lot of folks or makes them slow down. I love steep stuff. If it requires a lot of technical skill, I will love it.

I have a proper BMX bike that I bought in 2004 to learn proper bunny hop technique and general smoothness. It helped a lot. But I'd say riding motos and alpine skiing helped the most, along with a lot of movement analysis of world cup DH racers.

I've also ridden for about 10 yrs with a group of very high-skilled guys who have taught me stuff just by following them.

ianjenn · Mar 9, 2011

bpatterson6 said:
I started racing BMX back in 1977 in Austin, Tx. I raced BMX for 10yrs. Literally racing sometimes 7 times a week. Back then, I raced for some of the biggest companies in BMX. Mainly GT Bicycles. (I had #5 of the first 7 BMX frames that Gary Turner ever built) Myself and my other family involved in BMX had already ridden GT Frames for years & due to the fact that My dads brother Scott was the GT Factory BMX and Freestyle team manager for a few years and had a close relationship with Rich Long and Gary Turner I literally was able to get one of the first GT Mountain Bikes ever made. Around about 1983-84 GT Bicycles came out with the GT Backwoods Mountain Bike. I rode that mountain bike until the cranks literally fell off. I wish I still had it for nostalgic reasons. Scott later on worked with Bob Morales and expanded the AFA (American Freestyle Association). He and my aunt ran alot of Freestyle competitions all over the country.

Nice! I have a friend that got offered a full Factory ride on Hutch when he was 17 dad said no. Raced mainly west coast Upchurch last name you may know him? I rode and raced a little BMX started riding MTB's in 1985 on my mom's giant Ross. Got my own MTB in 1987 rode it on everything. Didn't start Downhill until 1999 or so. I also rode MX and spent a decent amount of time doing that as well. I think riding the rigid HT's from back in the day have sort of helped my line choice some.

jackalope · Mar 9, 2011

Pslide said:
Been riding for 15 years. Started riding steep stuff, technical stuff, and fast stuff on XC bikes with 71 deg head angles and long stems. Naturally I had to hang off the back, which is still my tendency to this day. I have to work hard to get my weight central and over my front wheel. For this reason I've never been very good at drifting, and I had to re-learn how to corner. Am decent at reading terrain and carrying speed though. Pretty lame at big jumps and style in the air. Old habits are hard to kick. Can still get down the hill pretty quickly despite it all...

This...Exactly...(well, except for the getting down the hill quickly part)

jnooth · Mar 9, 2011

I started racing BMX at the age of 8 back in 1996. I raced bmx for the next 8-8 years before I ever really knew what mountain biking was. I started out riding a bit of xc when i was about 16 and it took a very short time before I realized I really enjoyed going downhill and that the skills i acquired riding BMX allowed me to progress quite fast. I started racing DH about a year later when i got my first freeride bike. I was very talented right off and moved through the classes quickly but once I was up against faster riders i learned that being good on a bike and being a good racer were two very different things.

From a mental standpoint racing BMX and DH are two very different things. It took a while for me to understand that I cant approach a DH run like i would a BMX moto. I still do not have a great race head for DH although I think i have come a long way.

from a riding standpoint I think that my riding style was defiantly influenced by racing BMX. Instantly i was very comfortable in the air. Jumping came naturally and when the trail gets rough I tend to spend as much time off the ground as possible. One thing that bmx didn't help with was flat corners. They dont exists in BMX. I was very good at berms from the beginning but learning to ride flat corners was a bit of an ongoing process. Overall i think my bike handling skill is a direct result of me growing up on BMX. i personally think its the best way for kids to develop the best riding technique.

marshalolson · Mar 9, 2011

sponsored "freestyle" (before "freeride" was invented

) skier, early 90's ->late 2000's.

started riding XC once i moved to colorado in 97 as a way to train for the winter. started racing xc in 99, expert xc'er on a singlespeed with a 98 z1 till mid 2000's, when i started doing a bunch of urban fat to flat/trials sillyness up till 2005, and started riding DH then, which really finally clicked with the freeride mentality and flow of skiing and the exercise desires as well.

i am way better at pedaling and riding singletrack than i ever will be in tight berms. i am way more into step downs and fade away jumps than true doubles. seeing the backside of a big double for some reason freaks me out. i am used to sending 50 footers to steep snow landings with speed alot more...

somewhere in all of that above i split time managing bike shops in the summer and skis in the winter for 10+ years (1998-2009).

i now work in the ski business full time, so i ride ~75-100 days of dh a season during the slow season business wise, and only ski 40-50 days a year any more.

but yeah, all good

What did you ride before downhill and how does it affect your style now?

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