[cracked]

I asked this question inside of another thread; so I'm gonna re-post it here:

In your most excellent opinions of which there are many and very varied....

AT DIABLO( specifically ): What makes a trail a DOuble Black[like Utah or BMW] as opposed to a single black[like the Jack or triple drop]?

FR runs not withstanding I get why the jumps lines are BD's but what makes the rest? and why is Domboo easier then Breakouts?


discuss.........

 

[jonKranked]

Trails are rated by the number of riders they injure in a given month.

 

[Westy]

Trails you can't ride a hardtail on.

 

[CrabJoe StretchPants]

# of diamonds = # of balls it takes to ride it

 

[UncleSixPack]

AT DIABLO( specifically ): What makes a trail a DOuble Black[like Utah or BMW] as opposed to a single black[like the Jack or triple drop]?

Have you ridden BMW?

I can't speak for others, but Jack or Triple Drop are still easy enough to be a warm-up. I ride them on my enduro. Definitely not worthy of double black

BMW isn't so bad for the first couple-hundred feet, but it gets hairy later on. I can not clean the whole trail on my enduro, not matter how froggy I am feeling. You really need a DH bike and some advanced skills to maintain flow...specifics-jagged random rocks, off-camber turns, steep chutes with no run-out... things you have to commit to, can't do them half-way.

 

[TheTruth]

Diablo is rideable on a hardtail infact. Both dominions and phantom drop are do able on hardtails. But bmw to stigmata is in fact one of the only trails I would consider double black on the whole trails. Oh and covenant, slayer, evil bob(RIP), and morning wood.

 

[Westy]

Diablo is rideable on a hardtail infact. Both dominions and phantom drop are do able on hardtails. But bmw to stigmata is in fact one of the only trails I would consider double black on the whole trails. Oh and covenant, slayer, evil bob(RIP), and morning wood.

If those trails were at Whistler you wouldn't be allowed to ride a hardtail.

 

[Iridemtb]

# of diamonds = # of balls it takes to ride it

'

If I recall correctly, Dominion has 2 diamonds... Just for the record.

 

[Huck Banzai]

Diablo is rideable on a hardtail infact. Both dominions and phantom drop are do able on hardtails. But bmw to stigmata is in fact one of the only trails I would consider double black on the whole trails. Oh and covenant, slayer, evil bob(RIP), and morning wood.

Ripper? Epitaph? Breakout? Utah?

on a hardtail? with a gel-seat and a suspension seat post? 3" tires?

 

[cracked]

Wow.........it;s impressive that you guys ride those Double Blacks on a HT. I can't. Good on you!

NOW............back to the Question:

WHAT do you think MAKES these trails DOuble black and Single Black as opposed to Blue?


thx for the responses

 

[Hesh To Steel]

Does whistler actually not allow hardtails on certain trails? Or was that a joke?

 

[butters-lsd]

If those trails were at Whistler you wouldn't be allowed to ride a hardtail.

is this true? i think dirt merchant or a-line would be do-able for me on a HT. Dominion and Phantom, Alpine, are a blast... ripper or slayer not so much...

i don't ski or snowboard but would have to imagine it's the same thing.with warnings or in our case "difficulty levels", it's probably just a way for them to protect against lawsuits and such. and with skiing i'm sure there are the yahoo's that shouldn't be riding the double blacks just like we do.

 

[Huck Banzai]

It is a tricky game, because you could roll through Dominion and the liek slowly and be unchallenged - the challenge being properly doing the features (in this case big tables), whereas ripper et al, if you dont have the skill to keep the bike rolling and choose lines, you will not move, and must walk.

Then theres the combo skill/fear factor - not a lot of sections at diablo that make you want to go a different way -- maybe only that rockface whose name I always forget that is off of BMW/US Open; at other spots this is a big qualifier as even some non technical steeps are so steep they make the pooper clench up.


So what makes the diff I think is what is REQUIRED to ride the trail 'properly' so that BMW and Dominion are both blacks, but of diff type. I would like a multi rating system like minimum "Clench" factor/Tech Factor/feature factor -- so for dominion it would be Green/Blue/Black and ripper would be BLUE/BLACK/BLACK

ramble, rant, babble...

 

[Bikezilla]

Huck are you talking about Stigmata just after BMW? If anything at Diablo qualifies for DD it's BMW & Stigmata

Victory Double diamond if you ask me.

 

[cracked]

No Joke!!!! Victory should be a Double!! Fun as hell....but wow!

Nice pix 'zilla! That roller looks sick! I've never been on that trail.........it's above my pay grade!!

 

[Westy]

is this true? i think dirt merchant or a-line would be do-able for me on a HT. Dominion and Phantom, Alpine, are a blast... ripper or slayer not so much...

i don't ski or snowboard but would have to imagine it's the same thing.with warnings or in our case "difficulty levels", it's probably just a way for them to protect against lawsuits and such. and with skiing i'm sure there are the yahoo's that shouldn't be riding the double blacks just like we do.

It's true.
http://www.ridemonkey.com/forums/showthread.php?t=83372&highlight=hardtails

 

[TheTruth]

Ripper? Epitaph? Breakout? Utah?

on a hardtail? with a gel-seat and a suspension seat post? 3" tires?

utah should be single diamond. Epitaph is double and breakout should just be ride at own risk.

 

[sundaydoug]

No matter how many times I ride Victory I get sketched every time. That trail is a blast up until that rooty part.

 

[Bikezilla]

No Joke!!!! Victory should be a Double!! Fun as hell....but wow!

Nice pix 'zilla! That roller looks sick! I've never been on that trail.........it's above my pay grade!!

I should mention that Scrublover gets the camera credits!

So Covanent and the Canon just after get a double diamond right?

Anthem definately deserves a DD because it's so tricky to hit. Narrow and off line from the blind approach... hard to have enough speed to make it to the tranny.

Oh, and I think Alpine and Indycross should both get Double Diamonds until sombody sweeps the marbles off the berms.

And thanks to the park crew for cutting the sniperweeds back on Denial.

 

[cracked]

shameless photo whore^^^^^ hahaahahaha!!

Nice pix to scrublover...........

 

[Bikezilla]

shameless photo whore^^^^^ hahaahahaha!!

Nice pix to scrublover...........

guilty as charged! :d

 

[iandude94]

victory is deff one of my favorite trails. And when it comes to trail ratings i think it has to do with the steepness, rockyness and technecallity of the lines thru rocks.

 

[xtremedoritoes]

anthem does not deserve Double black diamond rating. I bet someone can hit the drop from the beginning of the bridge. I lose most of my speed by the time i get to the bridge anyway. lol

 

[AtomikMan]

I think the rating system has a lot to do with when the trail was built.......here's two of the more obvious "single black diamond" examples:

When Triple Drop was built, we were on 5" travel bikes and those wooden bridges weren't there. Back then, the trail seemed/was much harder than it is now.

When Victory was built, it was EASY. Since then, the last portion has gotten eroded and has exposed gnar roots and rocks, especially when wet. (Which, ironically seems to be one of the only parts of the mountain that IS always wet.)

Although, I totally agree that some of the trails do seem to be improperly rated, I also don't expect Diablo to re-rate everything all the time.

 

[DownhillR3]

AT DIABLO( specifically ): What makes a trail a DOuble Black[like Utah or BMW] as opposed to a single black[like the Jack or triple drop?

In simpler terms, Diamond= rocks, Double Diamond= more rocks

To be honest, I don't know how they rate the trails, I just ride everything.

 

[Ktrass15]

I have been riding at Diablo for three years and I have ridden about 90% (70% clean),
The trails that i have not attempted are above my comfort/ skill level. I would say that the trail's that are rated as double black require near perfect bike control and adequate speed, black diamond requires the same to ride through cleanly but it's possible to make it through or around with less speed or walking, and i really don't see much of a difference between blue and green

 

[smoke brakes]

nice you actually can understand the grade in those shots

 

[Huck Banzai]

I barely know trail names, even when I know the trails well! Yes, I was talking about stigmata -- espy if wet up top, the approach is tech, then you dump into it a swoosh.

Victory, Im not sure where that is, and Ive rarely looked up trails, so it seems unfamiliar, but Ive definitely hit every square inch of every trail there over the years!

I say Utah because it is the only trail I have ever been injured on at Diablo, and I know several others in the same boat. Its not evil appearing, but there are some spots that claim victims, I cant call em out, but when Ive discussed em, they're known.

Mind you, the injuries were from slomo moves -- 1 time I crept over a roll down, and my front wheel hooked a ledge and catapulted me....

So its evil maybe, but not nec a diamond...................

OH, I did smash my calf on a rock back in 03 when the tree table (the only notable jump at that time @ diablo) was less prepped and had a riser/wall with rut and rocks on the right side and I shifted over and managed to hit/land in it and blow the fek up!