Which bike do you prefer and why? Sorry for another "VS" thread, but please refrain from morbidly obese flamage. Opinions?
Rotec RL9, PDC 825, or Canfield F1
- Thread starter FactoryCostcoDH
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haha, well, they're all sweet options. I have a F1 for sale for cheap if you're interested.
That's why I said "what do you prefer." It doesn't matter what kind of riding that's going to be done on it. I just want to see how many people like each bike for their style of riding, or which one they think is of better build quality, etc.
If you really must know what I would do on any of them, I'd ride mostly aggressive playriding and DH racing, then do a little bit of hucking and freeride whenever I come across that kind of terrain. I might occasionally take it to a resort/park once Mt Baldy opens up down here in Southern California as well. I'm 5'8" and 140 lbs
If you could only choose one of the three and whichever one you pick is free, what decision would you make?
If you really must know what I would do on any of them, I'd ride mostly aggressive playriding and DH racing, then do a little bit of hucking and freeride whenever I come across that kind of terrain. I might occasionally take it to a resort/park once Mt Baldy opens up down here in Southern California as well. I'm 5'8" and 140 lbs
If you could only choose one of the three and whichever one you pick is free, what decision would you make?
Whatever....for a 140 lb. rider, a RL9 could be built at 42 lbs. and be bombproof. I'm 6'7" and 265...my RL9 race setup comes in at 44.5 lbs. My practice/whistler setup weighs in at 49.87 lbs. (the weight difference is all in the wheel and tire combo)
PDC's and Canfield's are very nice and very capable machines that I would love to own if money were no object, but you just won't get the kind of acceleration that a Rotec will provide.
.02
PDC's and Canfield's are very nice and very capable machines that I would love to own if money were no object, but you just won't get the kind of acceleration that a Rotec will provide.
.02
Hey Sqquirel,just a quick question whats the weight of your Rotec frame?
I thought the prototypes were 14.5-15 pound and the production ones were meant to be about 3 pounds lighter?
cheers
Yeah. The proto was basically a bunch of different stuff welded together. My production Large frame weighs in at ~13 lbs. with my Ti sprung Avy....at least that's what I remember from earlier this year.... (Sully - this is off the measurements I took, so please chime in with the frame weight without shock!!!).
It's solid. If any bike can withstand me and a full 3 weeks at Whistler, it deserves R35p3ct. Seriously.
Ok cheers dude, it's just Dropmachine.com on here said that his frame weighed in at 14 pounds which is pretty porky. I know it's not all about weight.
That 825 looks like a karpiel armageddon on the rear suspension with the difference being its shock is mounted to the lower link vs the upper link. They seem to have an almost identical rear section.
Mmmmmm.....pork.....
Here's another thought. Anyone have any complaints about any of the three or why they don't like one of them? (and don't say weight)
Prob. the 825, just because it looks cool!!!
I would have to suggest the Rotec RL9! After a whole season of racing the bike is still in very good shape! The frame weight which I find isn't too important is around the ballpark of many race bike frames. After taking a good look at the frame it instilles a great sense of confidence because it is very solid! How much the bike weighs shouldn't matter as much as how the bike rides, and let me tell you this bike rides awesome and could be one of the finest race bikes ever produced!!! The Canfeild on the otherhand is awesome for any terrain and rides very well. The builds that i've cruised around on were a little hard to manuever and the turning radius seems a little big! I have yet to experience the 825, but it does look cool! "Rotec's just ride better!!!!!!!!"
I'm telling Chris you said that, and I thought you guys were friends.
ahh brotherly love!
The one thing about the Canfield is the wheelbase. It is a bit long, and because of the suspension movement(rearword arc) it can feel that much longer at times. You really get used to it quick, and I was suprised on some of the things I was able to rally on it(super tight and tech) with no problems at all really. I've ridden some insainly steep stuff with no worries other than almost craping my pants because I was going faster than I was thinking I would through those sections!
They pedal really well, although there is a small amount of drag with the upper pully system, as long as you set it up your chainguide right, it's really not that bad. It's super active over bumps when you're pedaling, but there's pretty much no chain activated suspension bob. The only bob you get is strictly from your weight moving up and down, which is noticable at low speeds, but when you get your cadence up at all, it goes away pretty much all together.
The bike loves to go fast, loves big hits, loves steep stuff, loves rocky stuff. It's really a bike works really well. I'm selling mine only because the team is Ironhorse sponsored (sorry Chris!). If you're riding alot of VERY tight slower speed stuff then I might suggest probably the 825 because it's less travel, and bit of a shorter wheelbase I believe. But if you're looking for a sick super fast pinner bike that soaks up every bump in it's path, but is still lively enough to be able to lip off of little kickers to gap over sections, then I'd say the Canfield is an amazingly sick choice. I absolutely love mind, and it's the second one I've owned.
My top two downhill bikes of choice are the Sunday and the F1.
Anyone know how the rotec compares to the f1 when you're using it to freeride whenever you're not racing? So far I think of the rotec as the perfect bike for me, but I am unsure of how well it will work when it comes to hucking and lift access trails. I know it is a great DH race bike and I assume it also does well launching off bridges, hitting roadgaps, and dropping off the winnebago at your local trailerpark
. Anyone want to confirm this?
. Anyone want to confirm this?
I wish I could get this video online for you, but to answere your question imagine (my brother) 210lbs kid launching a 20ft down 25ft out, step down, with a dirt jump like lipped take off seriously like a big lip, so your probably 30ft above the landing at the height of the hit. All moto whiped out. The Rotec can definitly take some freeride action. No worries about that.Anyone know how the rotec compares to the f1 when you're using it to freeride whenever you're not racing? So far I think of the rotec as the perfect bike for me, but I am unsure of how well it will work when it comes to hucking and lift access trails. I know it is a great DH race bike and I assume it also does well launching off bridges, hitting roadgaps, and dropping off the winnebago at your local trailerpark
I've also seen other team rider Rich Mukai in Seattle throw down huge on some big knarly stuff out there, 45 ft. lip to lip step down, 25ft out and down creek gap step down, all flat tabled out.
I hope this helps confirm your opinions.
The rotec looks similar to the versus weapon x. Does anyone have a pic or info about the pdc 825, I can find anything.
Just how much does an RL9 frame cost? I'm going to have to do some saving but I was looking towards building my dream bike anyways.
nevermind, found it. pdcracing.com
alot. 2600 I think, or at least somewhere close. They're spendy. They'll stick to the ground and soak up everything, but they're a little heavy and super spendy.
As for big hucks, I'm sure it works great. The canfield makes you stick like velcro to the landings up big gaps and drops. Perfect example is lance being the only one not to bounce on the Super T drop in the '04 Rampage. He did it 3 or 4 times that weekend, the last one something went wrong and he went to the hospital, but it for sure wan't the bike's fault.
I want to say last year MSRP on the Rotec was around $2500 which is pretty comperable to any US made DH bike. Canfield F1 and PDC are $2350
I love how everyone fixates on the 14 pound figure that I quoted, and ignore the fact that IT DOESN'T MATTER.
The frame doesn't ride heavy, no tat all. In fact, it wants to just boost off the smallest bumps, and its super easy to bunnyhop. Again, I would much rather have a frame thats heavy and rides well then some stupid lightweight junk with inferior suspension designs. The Rotec straight out rocks, and the weight isn't noticible at all. Beleive me, I love takin the piss out of companies and citing downfalls, but the rotecs weight is just fine.
Besides, its not like its excess junk weight either. Certain suspension designs require more weight then others, and the dual stays of the Rotec require a bit more metal. They are machined all to hell, so its not like there is ridiculous blobs of weight hanging off the frame either.
Just try one, and you'll see.
The frame doesn't ride heavy, no tat all. In fact, it wants to just boost off the smallest bumps, and its super easy to bunnyhop. Again, I would much rather have a frame thats heavy and rides well then some stupid lightweight junk with inferior suspension designs. The Rotec straight out rocks, and the weight isn't noticible at all. Beleive me, I love takin the piss out of companies and citing downfalls, but the rotecs weight is just fine.
Besides, its not like its excess junk weight either. Certain suspension designs require more weight then others, and the dual stays of the Rotec require a bit more metal. They are machined all to hell, so its not like there is ridiculous blobs of weight hanging off the frame either.
Just try one, and you'll see.
I've only seen the rotec not be able to do one stunt before, well, only one of three nailed it. Pretty good sized step up - the Canfield ate it up though.Anyone know how the rotec compares to the f1 when you're using it to freeride whenever you're not racing? ..... I know it is a great DH race bike and I assume it also does well launching off bridges, hitting roadgaps, and dropping off the winnebago at your local trailerpark
The rotec rl9 is a nice bike fore sure. I had 2 runs on it a while ago, i ride a DHR normally.
Cockpit wise and handling felt very similar to my DHR if not a touch slacker in the head angle, it cornered almost as well but took the bumps a fair bit better then the DHR with low single pivot. Its not often i ride a bike and feel right at home on it.
And the bike did not ride heavy, i was popping and jumping it off everything with ease, but the DHR is slighty more nimble as would be expected.
I would say the rotec would be a good bike for someone looking for a strong bike that will last a while, and likes a bike that can rip the corners and who likes to take a more direct lines in a race. Its not as plow like as a v10 but not as nimble as the dhr, its somewhere inbetween, a good compromise imo. The bike is a good all round package. Does that help at all?
Cockpit wise and handling felt very similar to my DHR if not a touch slacker in the head angle, it cornered almost as well but took the bumps a fair bit better then the DHR with low single pivot. Its not often i ride a bike and feel right at home on it.
And the bike did not ride heavy, i was popping and jumping it off everything with ease, but the DHR is slighty more nimble as would be expected.
I would say the rotec would be a good bike for someone looking for a strong bike that will last a while, and likes a bike that can rip the corners and who likes to take a more direct lines in a race. Its not as plow like as a v10 but not as nimble as the dhr, its somewhere inbetween, a good compromise imo. The bike is a good all round package. Does that help at all?
That was an issue of shock set up, and probably rider error. Isn't there video of Brian Nailing the tree mid air.
But yes you and your canfield made it look purdy.
I want to go back there (what happened to the druleing smilly, I need one here)
But its' SOOOO heavy! haha. I know its' not that much heavier than most other frames, just over a pound heavier than the Canfield. But with that in mind, I have two things going against me, one, I don't weigh that much so the bike to rider weight ratio makes a bigger difference, and two, I'm not that strong... So I like a light bike. I've seen a 36 pound Intense Socom, and it makes me really jelouse. I'm hoping my Sunday this year will be in the 37-38 pound range.
My bike this year was only 39 pounds, but even then I could see different sections where I wish the bike was lighter or I was stronger... Mostly the stronger part, because a 39 pound dh bike isn't bad at all!
Frame weight is not really significant as long as its centralised. The design of the suspension and geometry is soooooo much more important.
The only time it matters is in the carpark, "omg your bike is so light test" or the "ridemonkey brag my bike is under 40lbs test" which is a load of crud
lthumbsdown:
The only time it matters is in the carpark, "omg your bike is so light test" or the "ridemonkey brag my bike is under 40lbs test" which is a load of crud
lthumbsdown:So then you build bikes just to have them light?
I would much rather have a bike that rides well and suits me then a bike thats light. Granted, I guess I am on the bigger end of the scale, but the weight of the rotec never even once bothered me when it counted.
All i can say is that if you have a chance, ride the bike. You will see why weight (at least the frames weight) will be your last concern. How to wipe the stupid smile off your face will be a much bigger priority.
I've never had a chance to ride a rotec on a trail, though I have pedaled one around and I think it had an avy front and rear. it was massivly heavy! but it didn't pedal like it was heavy.
I'm honestly not that big of a douchbag when it comes to weight. But I do understand that suspended weight and rotational weight is what matters. I also understand that having a super light build up and heavy cranks drops your center of gravity providing you with a bike that corners a bit better.
And yes, I am more concerned with geometry than anything else. I'm not even 100% pleased with the sunday goemetry. I'd like the headangle a little slacker(half a degree or so).
So I guess what I'm trying to say is that I hope I don't come across as a snob or a douchebag. I just know what I like and what works for me when it comes to my rides.
I'm honestly not that big of a douchbag when it comes to weight. But I do understand that suspended weight and rotational weight is what matters. I also understand that having a super light build up and heavy cranks drops your center of gravity providing you with a bike that corners a bit better.
And yes, I am more concerned with geometry than anything else. I'm not even 100% pleased with the sunday goemetry. I'd like the headangle a little slacker(half a degree or so).
So I guess what I'm trying to say is that I hope I don't come across as a snob or a douchebag. I just know what I like and what works for me when it comes to my rides.
and, like I said, the average DH frame is roughly 12 pounds. That's only 2 pounds lighter than the rotec. You can easily make that up in wheels and tires.
Rotec RL9 Abridged riding summary:Anyone know how the rotec compares to the f1 when you're using it to freeride whenever you're not racing? So far I think of the rotec as the perfect bike for me, but I am unsure of how well it will work when it comes to hucking and lift access trails. I know it is a great DH race bike and I assume it also does well launching off bridges, hitting roadgaps, and dropping off the winnebago at your local trailerpark
Me. 6'7". 265. 17 days at Whistler. Average 13 runs per day. (for you math majors that's 221 runs...half done on Garbanzo, all the way down.) Only things to go where a couple ders, handful of tubes, and a bent driveside crankarm. It rulz.
That's burley!
This bike sounds like it was made for me... I'm actually glad it's a little more towards the heavy side. That just means I can ride it longer and harder with less maintenance/down time.
On top of that, I am by no means a weight weenie. I enjoy riding my friend's beast of a cheeta prowler which weighs in a 53 lbs and I can comfortably race around a MX track on a 270 pound enduro bike. Please, no heart attacks for all you weight weenies
. If a 130-pound kid can jump a 270-pound 450 over a 40-50 foot step-up, then I think a 160 lb adult can handle a 45 lb DH bike. Just a hunch.
On top of that, I am by no means a weight weenie. I enjoy riding my friend's beast of a cheeta prowler which weighs in a 53 lbs and I can comfortably race around a MX track on a 270 pound enduro bike. Please, no heart attacks for all you weight weenies
. If a 130-pound kid can jump a 270-pound 450 over a 40-50 foot step-up, then I think a 160 lb adult can handle a 45 lb DH bike. Just a hunch.
quite true. I'm amazed how those guys can whip around moto bikes so easily. a bike is one thing. a several hundred pound moto is another.
Depending on how much cash you actually have to spend may be a desciding factor in what frame you get as well. Like I said, I have a F1 that's in great shape for $1500. comes with a king headset. I might be able to get a hub to throw in as well.
PMd ya about it, let me know.