Is point one still around? I wanted a fresh set of pedals and they seem to be unavailable....
Point one?
- Thread starter Ian Collins
- Start date
They are making a new pedal style which will be aviaible in April. They are sold out of the old pedal style. Great pedal.
thanks!
http://www.sicklines.com/gallery/data/1035/point-silver-prototype-pedal.jpg
That's it there. I tried to contact them about getting the new pedal for ages, but they were very frustrating to deal with.
Most of my emails weren't replied to, occasionally they'd get my hopes up and then come through with nothing. I like their stems but the old pedals had a few issues.
I gave up and ended up getting the spank spike w/ ti axles, which have been great.
http://www.ridemorebikes.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/07/spank-spike-ti-axle-gold-pins.jpg
That's it there. I tried to contact them about getting the new pedal for ages, but they were very frustrating to deal with.
Most of my emails weren't replied to, occasionally they'd get my hopes up and then come through with nothing. I like their stems but the old pedals had a few issues.
I gave up and ended up getting the spank spike w/ ti axles, which have been great.
http://www.ridemorebikes.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/07/spank-spike-ti-axle-gold-pins.jpg
We(Cankin) sold about 100 pairs here in Australia over five years and replaced three broken axles. The older type before they improved them. and otherwise we've replaced bearings in well used, heavily ridden sets. Mild sacrifice for a very thin wide pedal. If you want more reliability than that, just get a heavier thicker pedal, but nothing will protect any pedal from severe rock strikes. Pin replacement has never been an issue for us.
I'm currently trying a slightly lighter but thicker pedal from another brand we sell at the moment. They don't have the feel and confidence my PO1NTs do. They have aluminum pins to beat the PO1NTs weight. PO1NT offer aluminum pins too, but I only ever ran them in board safer from strikes. I did like PO1NTs longer pin option front and rear to milk more life from my well used five tens.
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The spanks pictured above are thinner, stronger (forged body instead of machined) and the same weight. The platform is also slightly larger I believe.
They're a better pedal all round than the current Point1. The new prototype would be a better competitor but it's vapourware for now.
Thanks! The new pedal looks good. I liked my point1 pedals a lot, eventually they had bearing issues and some hack (yours truly) broke the built in dust cover on the axle trying to service them.
They sent me a whole new axle kit for free, even after I told them exactly what I did.
New point1 proto/vaporware:
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They use a large bearing inboard and an IGUS bushing outboard, it seemed to be a very reliable system compared to others when I was researching - correct me if I'm wrong though. I think BMXConvert on here has many seasons on a set.
There are more documented failures on the Point1 and I suspect that's why they're taking so long with the new one.
Most pedals use a bushing as the primary load bearing interface, the bearing is used for two smaller duties - (1) provide axial locating support, i.e. in thrust and more importantly (2) to reduce lateral deflection of the pedal body.
Many manufacturers do not understand this relationship, which is why pedals like the HT AE0x/ME0x series and its derivatives such as the Canfield Crampon Ultimate experience accelerated bushing wear and shorter service life before play develops. This type of design either uses no bearing, or a thrust bearing that only supports axial loads (1) due to being external to the pedal body itself. You can get away with this in a thicker bodied pedal (eg. some Straitlines) due to larger diameter bushings, but in these thin pedals, it makes it easier for bushing wear to begin - and then wear increases exponentially - as the bushing/s experience localised loading over increasingly smaller surface area.
I don't think the Spank is perfect, as I suspect greater surface forces are seen on the outer end of the axle and you'd get a greater limitation on deflection if you put the bearing inside the body at the outer edge - however - you can't do this on pedals this thin as you'd have an insufficient bearing size for the load and/or an excessively thin axle.
I think this is where the current Point1 falls short - you can't go super thin and avoid bushings without seeing axle and bearing failure. You can however give the bushings a better chance at maintaining ideal loading with a good design - and thus have a very long service life.
Both the Podium and Spike have a good feature set - large platform, most or all pins are reverse entry, no convex, and relatively strong bodies at around 350g. Hopefully the new Podium irons out the axle and bearing issues.
I've ridden PO1NTs for years now. They don't develop any perceivable play, the smaller bearings just pretty much fail eventually.
Your convictions aren't facts UDI and even if they are close to factual, they're most likely a negligible amount. 11-13mm Vs 12mm isn't thinner. With steel, similar strength axles they're not lighter. Couldn't find the dimensions of the Spikes, but they don't look as square as the PO1NTs, so doubting there's much if anything is size difference. Personal preference on feel is probably MUCH more important. PO1NT offers different length pins to change feel and grip of pedal. Not sure if Spike do. PO1NT offered aluminum pins to reduce the weight to 339grams, but ally pins don't stay sharp anywhere near as long, and deform easy.
As for saying the Spikes are stronger, well there's a lot of guess work there isn't there?
Spikes would be an awesome pedal also, no doubting it. Better or worse than PO1NTs? I doubt there's much in it, and wouldn't make the call either way anyway. Coincidence and personal preference would make more of a difference I'd imagine.
Your convictions aren't facts UDI and even if they are close to factual, they're most likely a negligible amount. 11-13mm Vs 12mm isn't thinner. With steel, similar strength axles they're not lighter. Couldn't find the dimensions of the Spikes, but they don't look as square as the PO1NTs, so doubting there's much if anything is size difference. Personal preference on feel is probably MUCH more important. PO1NT offers different length pins to change feel and grip of pedal. Not sure if Spike do. PO1NT offered aluminum pins to reduce the weight to 339grams, but ally pins don't stay sharp anywhere near as long, and deform easy.
As for saying the Spikes are stronger, well there's a lot of guess work there isn't there?
Spikes would be an awesome pedal also, no doubting it. Better or worse than PO1NTs? I doubt there's much in it, and wouldn't make the call either way anyway. Coincidence and personal preference would make more of a difference I'd imagine.
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A friend had the "strong" Point1 steel axles snap. Jury's out on these Ti ones too of course, I'm on a prototype pair, but they've been fine so far and the team riders have been on them for a while with no breakages yet apparently.
Spank's axle and bearing design is superior to the current Point1. You're just defensive of what you sell as usual, I have no allegiance in either direction - actually had a thread on here earlier this year when I was deciding what to buy.
I think the new Point1 pedal on paper is a worthy competitor (and I actually tried to get my hands on a pair), although strength is questionable at the weights they claim on the new ones. In terms of what I was actually able to purchase, the Spanks were a better option.
Not saying they're bad pedals but I'd wait for the new ones (and a few reviews first) if I wanted podiums. Personally prefer the closed centre as well, because it means less seals and less drag.
Spank's axle and bearing design is superior to the current Point1. You're just defensive of what you sell as usual, I have no allegiance in either direction - actually had a thread on here earlier this year when I was deciding what to buy.
I think the new Point1 pedal on paper is a worthy competitor (and I actually tried to get my hands on a pair), although strength is questionable at the weights they claim on the new ones. In terms of what I was actually able to purchase, the Spanks were a better option.
Not saying they're bad pedals but I'd wait for the new ones (and a few reviews first) if I wanted podiums. Personally prefer the closed centre as well, because it means less seals and less drag.
I have no allegiances either. We sell what we believe in. They are what they are though. Light, thin pedals. We sell heavier thicker Reverse and Kowa pedals too. Both are super tough, and arguably tougher than the PO1NTs. My point was that you make the mildest differences sound like Armageddon is coming. We'd happily sell the Spanks too(after trying them). and I wonder if because PO1NT never called you back had anything to do with your anti PO1NT factual sounding opinion. The Spanks have taken a lot from PO1NTs design, they'd want to offer some benefits. They've had a good yard stick/template to work with.
PO1NT are brilliant with warranty. If you're buying a super light thin pedal you have to expect some risk of wear and tear compared to running one with bearings twice the size, and pedal body with twice the bulk. Everyones buying dangerously light frames with warranty as the justification. Pedals are a nearly perishable item as the chances of irreparable damage from rock strikes to any pedal is relatively high compared to lots of other components.
I have a few sets of PO1NTs and other pedals. The PO1NTs are all a few years old and still perfectly fine(replaced pins). I always run my youngest set on the DH bike.It's just logical for any kit. I move my bars and seat posts down through my bikes too(from DH to AM to XC).
Bushes suit lots of bike applications as well or better than bearings, even pivots, but the ease of bearings in many ways, and the minute benefits of bushes get pushed aside.
Don't confuse your opinion with the truth, and show the whole picture and all the facts, not just the ones that suit your convictions at the time.
Aesthetically, I think I like the look of the older PO1NTs better. But if the new ones are better who cares about aesthetics. I'd like to see maybe one more pin on the outside, but I guess they're not running it for better clearance.
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When I was searching for a pedal, I saw way too many documented cases of pedal bodies coming off and bearings failing. Why would I knowingly choose the inferior product? My emails to Point1 were asking whether the problems had been fixed on the new proto, and they said they had - if that is true, the new one will be good.
http://www.pinkbike.com/u/mikelevy/blog/Product-Picks.html (see user comments)
http://all-mountain-next.blogspot.com.au/2011/04/review-point-one-racing-podium-pedals.html
http://www.mtbr.com/cat/drivetrain/pedal/point-one/podium/prd_454087_135crx.aspx
See below for the facts, just a few of many examples. Also, read the Renthal stem thread - I was basically launching a sales campaign for the Point1 stem there. I'll call a spade a spade - Point1's DM stems are great, their regular stems could be better, and their current pedals could definitely be better:
From:
http://www.pinkbike.com/u/mikelevy/blog/Product-Picks.html (see user comments)
http://all-mountain-next.blogspot.com.au/2011/04/review-point-one-racing-podium-pedals.html
http://www.mtbr.com/cat/drivetrain/pedal/point-one/podium/prd_454087_135crx.aspx
The bushing end of mine have much slop, even with new axles, and new bushings. I think the pedal body just had crappy tolerance on the size of the opening for the bushing. They still work fine, and I like the size/shape, but they sound like cheap pedals. But they're expensive, so I am disappoint.
No dude, you'll call a spoon a spade, just to feel good about rambling on about something. So some pedals have failed that haven't been checked over once in a while and or have been ridden day in day out for ever. They're light weight thin pedals. The Spanks will not be ground breakingly better, stronger or more durable. They will have a limited life if unmaintained or abused due to their small tolerances also. If you want a fat axled, big bodied big bearing axle, get one. Hopefully the Spanks have some benefits over the PO1NTs that they've had to work from. Hopefully the new PO1NTs have some slight benefits over the Spanks. Anything will be small gains though.
I've never had trouble removing the bearings even if they're disintegrated and only outer race is there. Not easy, but not hard.
Get Kowas, Wah Wahs, or any of those other pedals made from that same cast if you want a super tough pedal. Still pretty thin and super comfy, just not light.
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Who said anything about ground breaking? I just pointed out that the old version (now discontinued it seems) of the Point1s had issues and that there are currently better options out there. As I said, I also hope that the new one has addressed these issues - and if so will be great.
You've gone from calling me a liar to claiming that people who had pedal failures "didn't check them" or "have ridden them forever and a day" based on nothing at all. I think you've got bigger problems than bike parts.
You've gone from calling me a liar to claiming that people who had pedal failures "didn't check them" or "have ridden them forever and a day" based on nothing at all. I think you've got bigger problems than bike parts.
Little butt hurt eh? Udi has always been straight up with his opinions, don't see what you're on about.
This thread:
Wow..
Until the Spanks ti axles are proven to be strong, if the pedals widths aren't compared side by side, and explained how/where they're measured, if both weren't weighed with the same pins(steel or ally), and if both aren't tested with the same impact to prove strength from multiple angles, then most of the first comments were either miss leading, inaccurate, unproven or over hyped and unnecessary.
I've had good success with the PO1NT pedals and find them very comfortable. Buy spanks if you want to buy something partially based on a guys opinion, if you want a more factual comparison, wait until The Spanks are older, and try both for yourself to see what your prefer.
I'd happily try the Spanks myself, but I'd not expect them to be as strong or durable as a pedal with thicker axles, and bigger bearings(not meaning PO1NTs here). But I'm cool with that, they are what they are, a light, thin serviceable(I hope)pedal. I'm pretty sure I'd prefer the PO1NTs shape, but that's my opinion.
I sensed UDI had the butt hurt from not being called back.
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