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Droop travel and you

Discussion in 'Downhill & Freeride' started by Sandwich, Apr 11, 2014.

  1. Sandwich just shake your rump

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    #1 Apr 11, 2014   
  2. kidwoo Celebrating No-Pants Day

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    bonus travel!!!
    #2 Apr 11, 2014   
  3. jackalope Mental acuity - 1%

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    I have no idea if the design actually accomplishes its stated goal, but seeing as pretty much all DH bikes have a goodly amount of sag (I used to run my old V10 at 40%), I would think they got the negative travel thing covered for the most part. As for a floater, I think pretty much everyone has figured out how to keep things reasonably active under braking via pivot placement and kinemagics. I mean sh!t, even Kona dropped the braker bar.

    EDIT - kinda related comment from mtg regarding braking -


    But in other news, still pretty wild to see Foes not only still around, but still making bicycles.
    Last edited: Apr 11, 2014
    #3 Apr 11, 2014   
  4. MrBaker87 New Member

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    Is that in any way similar to Kona's "Magic Link"?
    #4 Apr 11, 2014   
  5. jackalope Mental acuity - 1%

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    I don't think so. From what I recall from the "Magic Link" (btw, that always reminded me of Trek's "magic stays" on the Liquid) it just changed the geometry whenever it was pointed down or up.
    #5 Apr 11, 2014   
  6. Sandwich just shake your rump

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    the magic link was different, almost like have an axle area instead of a path, I think. Never rode one...

    this thing sounds like a very undersprung bonus shock that increases negative travel by a ton. It makes sense in a straight line where you never pick up your bike...but you'd never be able to hop anything again.
    #6 Apr 11, 2014   
  7. jackalope Mental acuity - 1%

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    Hell, even in a straight line it's nice to have the option to pop over stuff. That was one of the downsides of running mega-sag with my V10, it was like trying to get gelatin cranberry sauce to come out of the can.
    #7 Apr 11, 2014   
  8. Sandwich just shake your rump

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    but this has two shocks, potentially doubling the number of shims you can have.
    #8 Apr 11, 2014   
  9. jackalope Mental acuity - 1%

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    #9 Apr 11, 2014   
  10. Wetbed0 Member

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    I have a feeling, no science or experience to back this up, that the reason trophy trucks have so much sag, is because their center of mass is static. When you're strapped in, there is nothing you can do to weight either tire, or pick up the front or back. And the fact that you can keep the power on over really rough terrain. Anywhere your back wheel would normally leave the ground, you're not pedaling, and you probably don't plan on braking either. I don't see where the extra traction is coming from.

    In other news, my sunday felt like a slug with too much sag for my liking, couldn't imagine riding this.
    #10 Apr 11, 2014   
  11. yd35 Member

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    Floating brake? I think we know where Foes goes in the retro vs. modern debate.
    #11 Apr 11, 2014   
  12. Samoto Guest

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    Add Monster T fork! it would look nice with brake metal hose
    #12 Apr 11, 2014   
  13. jonKranked Press Button, Receive Stupid

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    this is foes we're talking about
    #13 Apr 11, 2014   
  14. Samoto Guest

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    MOAR SHIMZ

    #14 Apr 11, 2014   
  15. yd35 Member

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    Ha, I guess it's the equivalent of being surprised when Lindsay Lohan violates her parole.
    #15 Apr 11, 2014   
  16. kidwoo Celebrating No-Pants Day

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    I know I muscle my Tacoma around on rocky trails just like I do my bike.

    Just wait for the next big thing........wide diameter steering wheels. Heard it here first.


    The idea behind that foes is fine as long as you never need to actually hop over something. I don't think I have that much travel in my legs. Would be a sweet bike to sit down on though while riding.
    #16 Apr 11, 2014   
  17. jonKranked Press Button, Receive Stupid

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    i'd still like to throw a leg over it for a run or two.
    #17 Apr 11, 2014   
  18. yd35 Member

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    The negative travel could be quite useful in limited gravity situations, like the moon or Mars.
    Last edited: Apr 11, 2014
    #18 Apr 11, 2014   
  19. Sandwich just shake your rump

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    this is the big one, I think. On motos/trucks the longer your wheels are on the ground, the faster you go. I thought that was why the "scrub" was invented- you can still go super fast but your wheels are back on the ground sooner so you can get back to accelerating.

    On a bike acceleration is so much more complicated...from chain torque to rider bobbing to undulating terrain. I think this would only hurt there, but it could potentially be useful for braking. If you could have constant traction braking through the roughest stuff, you could brake later. I just don't know if that's important enough to matter, as even if the tires are on the ground, brakes still have to work, tires still have to grip, etc...
    #19 Apr 11, 2014   
  20. kidwoo Celebrating No-Pants Day

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    You mean you don't pump transitions in your rock crawler?

    noob
    #20 Apr 11, 2014   
  21. norbar Active Member

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    Is Foes an anagram to contrarian? Because he tries so damn hard to be different and while it may have worked in 2003 now if you have nothing to say isn't it better to just offer what people want? I'm pretty sure if it offered great geo, a decent pivot point and good leverage rate people would love a well made and us made lightweight dh frame.

    Also is anyone surprised by that MRP fork?
    #21 Apr 11, 2014   
  22. Sandwich just shake your rump

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    i keep my elbows out in the corners
    #22 Apr 11, 2014   
  23. rpet Active Member

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    Needs moar Curnuts
    #23 Apr 11, 2014   
  24. Vrock New Member

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    I like it, the new Hydro looks too normal to be a Foes... and all the curnutts are gone in the small bikes, the man needed to do something crazy!!!
    #24 Apr 11, 2014   
  25. ChrisRobin Active Member

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    Well he could try something like 8" travel with maybe only 2"...that might be more reasonable.
    #25 Apr 12, 2014   
  26. TrumbullHucker Member

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    i dig it... i feel like the potential 12" is a little much though
    #26 Apr 13, 2014   
  27. GekoES Member

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    Actually, that doesn't count as travel per se, it is just a nearly dead shock that allows the wheel to follow better the terrain, it is like having 3 inches of play in the rear.
    #27 Apr 13, 2014   
  28. Muddy New Member

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    Not practical from a bike-centered viewpoint -- just in DH oriented riding on it's own it will be binned with HammerSchmidt cranksets in almost a full year.
    #28 Apr 13, 2014   
  29. HardtailHack used an iron once

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    I can see benefits but an air Curnutt could have been designed to have negative travel built in, having extra bits seems a bit crazy?
    Maybe an April fool's day joke that everyone missed.

    I'd love to have a go on it.
    #29 Apr 13, 2014   
  30. joeg Member

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    "Accessing the full 12-inches of travel is only possible when the bike is unweighted and the rear wheel can drop down"

    pretty sure this is how you "access" the travel on any bike that sags.

    The rest of this post had to be deleted, but since this is ridemonkey: imagine many ***** and you get the idea.
    #30 Apr 13, 2014   
  31. Wetbed0 Member

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    #31 Apr 13, 2014   
  32. HardtailHack used an iron once

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    Would go well with?
    #32 Apr 13, 2014   
  33. Wetbed0 Member

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    Not enough travel. Monster t with 888 spring
    #33 Apr 13, 2014   
  34. maxyedor <b>TOOL PRO</b>

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    Really stupid way to describe what is essentially position sensitive damping and spring-rate, but rather than running a bypass tube and dual-rate coils like a TT shock, he's using a second damper with light valving and a "zero" rate. Should have gone back to the Curnutt and just built in a bypass zone, but then people would enter "Oh-noez, it's a Curnutt" mode.

    I'm curious how it will work as you'd have essentially no ground pressure (What's a wheel, tire, cassette, and half the swing-arm weigh?), so I can't see it helping much, but would love to try it.
    #34 Apr 13, 2014   
  35. Muddy New Member

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    Not without respect for Brent Foes and reverence toward his Companies bikes, but part of the riding experience is that hardtail flick which is characteristic. It doesn't have to be a DW*Link bike to possess it. Sure I'm not likely to be at InterBike but these still seems fleeting - I'm not seeing this as a full meal at this time.
    #35 Apr 13, 2014   
  36. Jm_ Active Member

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    So much truthiness.
    #36 Apr 13, 2014   
  37. 4130biker Active Member

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    It seems like you'd need a second spring for it to be effective. I agree with some of the sentiment heere that straight line may not benefit much. But imagine off camber/rough sections, that lighter rate and extra travel could help the rear stay hooked up in a situation like that. Also corners with deep chatter leading into them it could keep from sliding as early?

    Who knows, but Id like to try it!
    #37 Apr 13, 2014   
  38. Wetbed0 Member

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    Anyone want to put a short spring in their bike and tell us how it feels?
    I would, but I just sold my dh bike.
    #38 Apr 13, 2014   
  39. Jm_ Active Member

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    I thought that about Curnut shocks.
    #39 Apr 13, 2014   
  40. joeg Member

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    springs in series work like one spring. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Series_and_parallel_springs
    #40 Apr 14, 2014   

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