From reading the website it looks like the secondary shock is just a bottom out to lower the leverage ratio...rad. I would imagine if tuned correctly they would work simultaneously, unlike the animation on the site, creating a travel 'area' like those sinister frames or whatever.
ahh, yes reading...From reading the website it looks like the secondary shock is just a bottom out to lower the leverage ratio...
It's been done a few times. Most succesfully (I think) by http://www.2stagebikes.com/That is different with the two rear shocks, have never seen that before.
That 2 stage bike is pretty sick looking.It's been done a few times. Most succesfully (I think) by http://www.2stagebikes.com/
i'd just love to see somebody design a dual shock to have a travel area, vertical and back. Nobody seems to want to do it, everybody's all "stable platform" or "air assist" or don't design it right. Even sinister couldn't make it work, number one, and if they had, it would have had limited travel in it's upper rear position (because of running one shock) and that's where you need the most travel.
these guys are real close, but I wish the main pivot were higher. I think if you tuned both shock soft enough you could get the travel area...
hopefully...although the picture looks like a computer image and not the real deal...here's something cool. all those new photos we saw of the 2008 888 had drop crowns. the one here looks like it has flat. good to see
It is definitely not just a single pivot. You cannot get a multi directional axle path out of a single pivot. The animation clearly shows the axle path moving in two distinct stages.it is essentially a single pivot with an addition back up shock thrown in.
Really, by who? Serious question.it's unique, but it has been done
Actually it seems to follow a close to vertical path up though the first 7" of travel, then moves sharply rearward through the last 2 1/2". This makes good sense to me as the bike would maintain a shorter wheelbase for turning and less dramatic hits enabling better handling, and lengthen to become more stable on large hits and landings.it basically adds a vertical piece to the wheelpath at the end of the stroke. i love the looks, but i won't be buying one.
Here's something uncool,here's something cool. all those new photos we saw of the 2008 888 had drop crowns. the one here looks like it has flat. good to see
they delayed it another year, haven't taken into account brake jack or pedal lockout, and haven't said anything about it since they said they weren't producing it this year.Who say's Sinister can't make it work? From what I hear it's a priority r&d project for as soon as possible release.
throw 2stage in there too. maybe the wheelpath hasn't ever been exactly duplicated, but the design is definitely not original. i also recall a smaller german company having something, i'll dig around for it.Really, by who? Serious question.
Karpiel, Kenisis, and I think BCD has done a dual rear shock frame
Well, delaying production and continuing to do r&d would indicate that Sinister feels they can make the Passion work, but they don't want to use consumers as a test bed. That is good business.they delayed it another year(the Passion), haven't taken into account brake jack or pedal lockout, and haven't said anything about it since they said they weren't producing it this year.
Since when do pedal feedback and square edge bump compliance have anything to do with number of pivots?throw 2stage in there too. maybe the wheelpath hasn't ever been exactly duplicated, but the design is definitely not original. i also recall a smaller german company having something, i'll dig around for it.
as for "not being a single pivot", it may not be in the last bit of the stroke when that second shock is engaged, but it is certainly a single pivot in the beginning. go to the site and drag the little grey cursor up through the travel. the suspension is rotating around on one pivot only, a quality single pivots are known to have. i'd like to make it so i can draw the wheelpath, but i don't know how. anyways, it remains in single pivot mode until it uses all of the travel and the little air shock engages. then the wheelpath turns vertical. this makes sense as well, and with the use of their special chain guide that they are going to use, it could make it handle fairly well. hopefully they will be using a design that will counteract the bad pedal feedback that single pivots have. in that case, the bike will still have the great square edged bump compliance that single pivots have. the wheelbase will be slightly lengthening nontheless, but because of that, it will be more stable as the hits start getting bigger. the wheelbase will reach a maximum length at the point the first shock bottoms out, and then the air shock will send the wheel into a vertical path, maintaining the long wheelbase for stability but changing the wheelpath into a vertical one. ever done a big drop on a horst link bike versus a single pivot? horst link frames feel much more under control absorbing that force because it travels in line with the wheelpath.
I know you just like to argue, but I'll play ball.Well, delaying production and continuing to do r&d would indicate that Sinister feels they can make the Passion work, but they don't want to use consumers as a test bed. That is good business.
As for "brake jack and "pedal lockout", if the design does exhibit those characteristics, they can be minimized or eliminated in a number of ways, including floating arms and replacement of the travel "area".
it is a key problem with the single pivot design. single pivots work better on square edged hits than a bike with a vertical wheelpath because the rear wheel is allowed to move backwards and up. this, however, increases tension on the chain and causes pedal feedback. a single pivot can't achieve a vertical wheel path, which is why the horst link was made. it allows for a vertical path that doesn't result in chain growth, but because the wheelpath is vertical, square edged bump compliance is compromised. rather than being able to move backwards and up to minimize the slowing effects of the bump, the bike just slams into it, and more momentum is taken away.Since when do pedal feedback and square edge bump compliance have anything to do with number of pivots?