[big-ted]

So, as if the proliferation of new and pointless standards that force retailers to stock an obscene number of permutations of each product in order to compete isn't enough, now there's this:

http://www.bicycleretailer.com/north-america/2015/08/03/trek-begin-online-bike-sales-—-dealers-will-assemble-bikes-and-get-service?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter# .VcDF4HiToTD

On the flip side, The YT model undoubtedly has resulted in cheaper products to the consumer by elliminating the middle-man.

Discuss.

 

[Bikael Molton]

You assume I have a LBS.

I don't have an LBS that's trustworthy to have anything MTB-related in stock or have mechs that can service MTBs, and I'm not the only one in this situation. Don't get me started on having custom wheels built.

If it brings prices down, I'm all for it.

 

[Sandro]

Doesn't sound quite as pernicious when you read the whole thing and seems like an attempt to go with the times while still maintaining a strong connection to the dealer network.

As part of the check-out process, consumers will be asked to choose the local Trek retailer that they want to service their order. Consumers will not be able to choose “none of the above.”

The chosen retailer will receive a service commission equal to their normal margin — which varies depending on the size of the store’s business with Trek — minus an estimation of the costs that Trek shoulders (and the retailer avoids) in making the online sale. That includes the cost of carrying the inventory, shipping and sales. The bottom line? Retailers will receive roughly 80 percent of their normal margin on these new sales.

 

[cecil]

On a few occasions when I got my bike back from Lbs I found scratches, helicoils, stripped screw heads.....needless to say they went out of buisness

 

[wood booger]

Doesn't sound quite as pernicious when you read the whole thing and seems like an attempt to go with the times while still maintaining a strong connection to the dealer network.

You miss the point that dealers are now making less margin on the bikes, and Trek is keeping more.

Staying with the online times->yes
cheaper for the consumer->no
less $ for LBS->yes (losing 20% of current margin)
more money for Trek-> yes

Can't wait to see how Specialized responds!
They have bent over backwards to not go direct and stay fully embedded in the dealers.

 

[maxyedor]

I read it totally differently, lets you order the bike you really want straight from the manufacturer and then give your LBS some business by way of receiving and assembling the bike. Presumably they'll also be servicing said bike down the road as well.

Seems like a smarter plan than the state of affairs. If shops want to carry high end bikes, they have to take a guess at what they'll sell and do a large buy-in early in the year, that leaves them with none of bike a and shit-tons of bike b at the end of the season. They lose the customer looking for a, and have to slash prices just to get rid of bike b. Really stupid scheme that results in a lot of overpriced accessories and service to try to maintain a reasonable margin.

I say good job Trek, now knock it off with your silly acronyms and "standards"

 

[blindboxx2334]

let me get this straight:

they are selling direct to the consumer.... BUT
they will not ship to your house... OR
let you pick up and assemble at your own house?

so its 'consumer-direct', but you have to jump through some fiery hoops?

 

[jonKranked]

I read it totally differently, lets you order the bike you really want straight from the manufacturer and then give your LBS some business by way of receiving and assembling the bike. Presumably they'll also be servicing said bike down the road as well.

Seems like a smarter plan than the state of affairs. If shops want to carry high end bikes, they have to take a guess at what they'll sell and do a large buy-in early in the year, that leaves them with none of bike a and shit-tons of bike b at the end of the season. They lose the customer looking for a, and have to slash prices just to get rid of bike b. Really stupid scheme that results in a lot of overpriced accessories and service to try to maintain a reasonable margin.

I say good job Trek, now knock it off with your silly acronyms and "standards"

Also saves the lbs from having to have random bikes as overhead.

And let's be honest here. Bike shops don't make their money on bikes, they make it on service and accessories.

 

[jonKranked]

Also situations where the closest trek dealer is say, an hour away. You won't waste two hours of driving time just to be told "we don't have that, but we can order it"

 

[Toshi]

Also situations where the closest trek dealer is say, an hour away. You won't waste two hours of driving time just to be told "we don't have that, but we can order it"

Ah, the problems of the rare era after invention of automobiles (and mountain bikes) but before the invention of the telephone.

 

[jonKranked]

Ah, the problems of the rare era after invention of automobiles (and mountain bikes) but before the invention of the telephone.

A surprising number of Americans aren't that smart.

 

[OGRipper]

You miss the point that dealers are now making less margin on the bikes, and Trek is keeping more.

That may be true if you look at it in a vacuum, but theoretically the cost to the dealers will do down as well - they can save some dough on inventory, warehouse rent, etc. So a dealer's overall profit from a particular sale might go up. I suppose that will depend in part on if/how Trek changes existing programs for pre-season orders, inventory levels, etc. From the dealer's perspective, we can hope it's a coordinated approach and dealers don't need to order/hold as much product.

Your comment also assumes the LBS would get the same customer in the door to buy from the LBS in the first place. That's just not such a safe assumption these days. This could help dealers obtain customers that might otherwise have never walked into the shop. Whether they retain the customer will then depend on their service - isn't that how it should be?

I'm not saying Trek is doing this purely to help dealers but it seems they at least recognize the need for LBS support and are trying to keep their dealers happy and healthy despite changing times.

I'll also be really surprised if it turns out Trek is the only one of the bigger companies to do this.

 

[kickstand]

I care none about any of my lbs's they all suck and I'd rather not let them touch my bike

 

[Kanye West]

Ah, the problems of the rare era after invention of automobiles (and mountain bikes) but before the invention of the telephone.

Bike shops are MORE than capable of misrepresenting their inventory over the phone, only to have you arrive and give you the same wonderful "we can order it.....brah" bullshit.

In this day and age, there is no reason to pay someone else a premium to order something, and commute to their location TWICE to get a damn part.


Shops need to realize that they exist for SERVICE, and it probably costs them money to exist as a sales floor with the amount of investment into inventory and floor space maintenance that it requires. Service requires minimal floorspace, and minimal overhead for the tools and smaller expendables. Labor is the biggest cost, but conveniently it's the highest charge/highest margin.

If the floorspace of smaller shops were utilized to have more workstations and techs working, and not dangling odd-sized unaffordable bikes, they'd print money.

If some of that money were used to market them as ultra-fast turn high-capacity service shops to keep all those workstations busy...we'd hear less whining about the charity-case LBS situation.

These bitchy LBS's need to get out of their own way. Glad the manufacturers are starting to help.

 

[gemini2k]

Finally a step in the right direction. I guess the bike industry finally realized this thing called the internet exists. God I hate nearly all my local bike shops.


Oddly enough this weekend I bought my first bike in 15 years off a bike shop sales floor.

 

[Mo(n)arch]

I care none about any of my lbs's they all suck and I'd rather not let them touch my bike

This.
Answers like "we don't have these parts stock (a XT hanger) but we can order it" with a one month wait for the said part to arrive is not acceptable.

Before selling my '09 Session I went to the LBS where I bought it. I knew that the bearings in the hubs and rear end should be checked and eventually renewed. Suspension was serviced shortly before. I told the LBS also to bleed the brakes and center the wheels so the bike would be flawless for the new owner, which is a guy from my area and shares a few friends with me.
After a week I went to the LBS, paid a not so low sum and went to the guy, which wanted to buy the bike. Guess what?
After I sold it (I had a lot of luck to be able to do so) the new owner had to change the bearings in the hubs, in the rear end and had to bleed the brakes.
Fortunately he is an uncomplicated guy and didn't want me to step in for the additional costs. But nowadays I do all the work on my bikes by myself, except wheels. There's a bike mechanic in my area that works mostly on desperate houswives' city cruiser, but he does a good job on wheels.
I also bring him just the wheel to work on. No tire or anything on the wheel except maybe the cassette.

You simply cannot trust those damn bikeshops, even if you've bought your damn bike there.

 

[tabletop84]

this happens when a clueless guy goes to the average lbs and buys a mountainbike:

 

[Sandwich]

I bought my first bike off the LBS showroom floor for the first time in 15 years. It was more than I had ever spent on a bike, and it was new, at retail. I went in a few months later about a problem I had with a different part, and they couldn't be bothered to stop at the service station and answer a question. It took me 20 minutes to flag down the sales guy that sold me the bike to ask him whether my part was toast or not. And that's to a paying customer waiting in line.

I'll probably never buy another bike from an LBS again. I'd rather mail order it and assemble myself. There's another local shop that i trust for most small services (bearings, hubs, wheels) that I'll continue to use for any service related issues, and I'll stick to mail order for everything else. I'll be building my second set of wheels, and short of having a set of housing clippers, I can do everything else myself.

I agree, the LBS is standing in their own way. Selling moms and kids bikes is one thing...

 

[jonKranked]

i think a lot of it depends on the shop itself. these days they've gotta go beyond just selling bikes & parts, and servicing them. the shops i've seen killing it are the ones who hold clinics and organize group rides. that kind of stuff.

 

[Mo(n)arch]

Jep, that's how a shop in Germany operates, where my mates bought 4 Specialized Demo together. The boss opened the shop about 5 years ago and needed to move to a bigger flat already two times. He has a lot of testbikes and organizes testrides every Saturday, where he rides together with the clients answering questions and helping out with setup etc.
Needless to say, business is good.
There's a bar in the shop too, so you can chill there.
But you know, the shop is a 5 hour drive from either Zurich and South Tyrol away. So not really a LBS.

 

[6thElement]

I've never set foot in the "LBS" I use, it's in Portland and I'm on the East Coast.

I probably use Universal Cycles for 90%+ of my parts needs. Do all my own bike builds, wheels and wrenching just relying on others for specialist shock servicing.

Any time I go in a bike shop near me they don't have the simple part I want or it costs 3x what it costs online.

 

[jonKranked]

I've never set foot in the "LBS" I use, it's in Portland and I'm on the East Coast.

I probably use Universal Cycles for 90%+ of my parts needs. Do all my own bike builds, wheels and wrenching just relying on others for specialist shock servicing.

Any time I go in a bike shop near me they don't have the simple part I want or it costs 3x what it costs online.

sadly i'm the same way. i only go to the LBS if i need something done that i don't have the tools for (which at this point is just facing and chasing, and i don't plan on buying those tools well, ever) or need something simple in a punch, like a tube or shifter cable.

 

[Electric_City]

Some thoughts on this.

Does this mean the LBS won't need to pay up for the bike? Ie. Trek sells a $1500 bike, then the shop doesn't have to pay wholesale price. It makes sense to me. If a bike came into the shop that didn't cost me anything up front, and I make a couple hundred off of a half hour assembly, I'm up for that.

To the one or two others that say LBS are "repair shops" anymore- Good luck with that. Myself and another shop employee used to talk about saving up so we could open a shop (7 years ago or so). The issue is every wholesaler wants pics of the inside, outside (of the shop) pics of the hours of operation that are posted on the door, a phone bill with the company's business address on it and a working phone and fax#, references of other bicycle manufacturers you have open accounts with and the ability to do a credit check. Fortunately/unfortunately, this closed down the back ally shops. This kept the shops that are a real business open though.

 

[kazlx]

It's funny how people that have complaints, have the same complaints about LBSs. I try to avoid shops as much as possible. Then, there's usually a time when I really need something done and don't have time to do it myself and take it in. That's when I remember why I don't take my shit to shops.

It seems like quite a few shops would get 'sales' from bikes they didn't technically 'sell', they might just be the closest retailer for someone. Seems like a good opportunity to create a long term customer.

 

[StiHacka]

I only go to LBS once in a full moon to get a small part when something breaks and I don't want to wait for a delivery or pay $$ for shipping. I figured that if I need a job done that is too complicated for me to do easily, the LBS usually won't want to do it either.

There's another local shop that i trust for most small services (bearings, hubs, wheels) that I'll continue to use for any service related issues, and I'll stick to mail order for everything else.

Is that JRA? Wheelworks? CycleLoft? Other place?

 

[DH Dad]

I only go to LBS once in a full moon to get a small part when something breaks and I don't want to wait for a delivery or pay $$ for shipping. I figured that if I need a job done that is too complicated for me to do easily, the LBS usually won't want to do it either.

Is that JRA? Wheelworks? CycleLoft? Other place?

Since we're talking about Boston Metrowest/north LBS I'll share my experience as I've just searched recently for parts. Landry's these days are useless for anything other than last minute Sealant or a tube. MTB stock is extremely low and their sales guys make mistakes over the phone. Called last week looking for a 28.6 seatpost or 27.2-28.6 shim. Guy didn't know what a shim was but told me he had a post. When I show up he pulls out a 26.8, he said he assumed I made a mistake as he's never heard of a 28.6. Wasted trip. Called all over and the only place that had what I needed was Wheel Works. Similar experience 6 months ago looking for parts.

LBS needs to tailor to it's consumer base and Landry's is basically roadie central these days, MTB footprint keeps getting smaller and smaller and I constantly find myself educating their service techs when it comes to older MTBs and issues such as various ISCG bolt patterns, oddball seatposts, DH Tubes(they're a specialized dealer and didn't even know Spec sold DH tubes). 3-4 years ago they had some of the most knowledgable MTB techs in the business.

 

[Sandwich]

Wheelworks belmont sold me my enduro.

Frank's spoke and wheel in waltham is where I go for most service stuff/small bits like lights and such. They're the proto-typical hole in the wall bike from 1995 on display 1" steerer sort of place, but they're good people.

The best service I've ever gotten has been at the Cycle Loft in burlington. They are pretty cheap, incredibly quick, and thoroughly professional. They cut 64 straight pull spokes for me for free once. They're MTB stuff has been shrinking a bit; they used to carry Dainese and all kinds of DH schwag, now they don't have anything.

I like JRA, but their bikes are either incredibly high end or entry level, at least last time I went in there. Great selection and really good people.

 

[jonKranked]

their bikes are either incredibly high end or entry level, at least last time I went in there. Great selection and really good people.

this is where i think trek's new option could be good for shops. most shops stock mostly low end, and some mid to high end stuff (with little variety). the kind of rider (at least MTB) that wants the higher end bike is the kind of person who is more likely to shop online anyways. this has the potential to get more sales through a trek dealer. the shop gets the sale without having to have the bike on the floor or in inventory, and the rider gets what they want with most of the convenience they are looking for.


just another reminder - shops don't make most of their money on bike sales, regardless of whether or not they are high or low end bikes.

 

[StiHacka]

I like JRA, but their bikes are either incredibly high end or entry level, at least last time I went in there. Great selection and really good people.

They have a fairly good selection of bikes these days: high end like Pivot, Ibis, Yeti, but also more affordable bikes from Intense, C'dale, Niner, Kona, Devinci, Rocky Mountains... Even some DH bikes IIRC.

 

[Sandro]

Jep, that's how a shop in Germany operates, where my mates bought 4 Specialized Demo together. The boss opened the shop about 5 years ago and needed to move to a bigger flat already two times. He has a lot of testbikes and organizes testrides every Saturday, where he rides together with the clients answering questions and helping out with setup etc.
Needless to say, business is good.
There's a bar in the shop too, so you can chill there.
But you know, the shop is a 5 hour drive from either Zurich and South Tyrol away. So not really a LBS.

Which magical shop is that? Sounds like it might not be too far from my area.