First Ride on Hardtail

**Serial Midget** · 06-02-2003, 08:24 PM

I took my new hardtail out for the first time tonight and did about 7 miles – a 1/3 road 1/3 trail and 1/3 fire road near my house. I was pleased and surprised at the high speed stability, I was expecting a somewhat harsh ride but didn’t get it. Longer trial rides might be a different story.

I couldn’t really hammer on the climbs because I still do not have the long seat post and I was running moss pedals. I didn’t notice any particular difference but I might when I decide to really hammer.

On a slight rolling downhill bit (not technical) I clipped along at 19 MPH and could have gone faster except my feet became unstable on the pedals – clipless are mandatory on a hardtail. All my previous 'true' mountain bikes have been full suspension and I never had any trouble pedaling fast on those… hmmm?

The wheel base on this bike is about 2” shorter than my last ride – I’m liking it so far.

I get the right sized seat post and stem on Wednesday and hope to get in a decent 100% single track run in.

ALSO: Avid 185s are stupid heavy on an XC bike - but DAMN!!! They gots the power!

**indieboy** · 06-02-2003, 08:30 PM

Originally posted by Serial Midget
I took my new hardtail out for the first time tonight and did about 7 miles – a 1/3 road 1/3 trail and 1/3 fire road near my house. I was pleased and surprised at the high speed stability, I was expecting a somewhat harsh ride but didn’t get it. Longer trial rides might be a different story.

I couldn’t really hammer on the climbs because I still do not have the long seat post and I was running moss pedals. I didn’t notice any particular difference but I might when I decide to really hammer.

On a slight rolling downhill bit (not technical) I clipped along at 19 MPH and could have gone faster except my feet became unstable on the pedals – clipless are mandatory on a hardtail. All my previous 'true' mountain bikes have been full suspension and I never had any trouble pedaling fast on those… hmmm?

The wheel base on this bike is about 2” shorter than my last ride – I’m liking it so far.

I get the right sized seat post and stem on Wednesday and hope to get in a decent 100% single track run in.

ALSO: Avid 185s are stupid heavy on an XC bike - but DAMN!!! They gots the power!

glad you are liking the new bike!!!

**LostBoyScout** · 06-02-2003, 08:31 PM

Originally posted by Serial Midget
could have gone faster except my feet became unstable on the pedals – clipless are mandatory on a hardtail.

Ahem... you just need to bend your knees.

Other than I dissagree on the clipless deal (I've raced DH on a hardtail with flats and no probs.. just gotta be real loose), good stuff!! Hardtails are good fun. The FS is nice for long rides but otherwise, hardtail all the way!

**indieboy** · 06-02-2003, 08:34 PM

Originally posted by LostBoyScout
Ahem... you just need to bend your knees.

Other than I dissagree on the clipless deal (I've raced DH on a hardtail with flats and no probs.. just gotta be real loose), good stuff!! Hardtails are good fun. The FS is nice for long rides but otherwise, hardtail all the way!

xc you need em though, can't climb for SHIET on flats.......

**Serial Midget** · 06-02-2003, 08:41 PM

Originally posted by LostBoyScout
Ahem... you just need to bend your knees.

My seat post was about 1 1/2 or maybe 2" too short so that may have been an issue too. I had the sensation of spinning out when I knew I wasn't - plus mosh pedals hurt when they turn into meat grinders.

EDIT L B S - I see what you meant - once I stopped pedaling stability returned, it was when I was spinning fast that my feet wanted to fly off. This cost me speed and momentum - I typically ride clipped in but just about everyone I nkow will want to give the new frame a spin so... mosh pedals for a week or so.

**Serial Midget** · 06-02-2003, 08:43 PM

Originally posted by indieboy
xc you need em though, can't climb for SHIET on flats.......

I know this is true so I didn't even try.

**Skookum** · 06-02-2003, 08:46 PM

Originally posted by indieboy
xc you need em though, can't climb for SHIET on flats.......

Not true...... I used to think that as well, it's just a matter of knowing HOW to pedal flats.
My friend busted his knee up and had to switch to flats and still outpedals me up the hills (not that's much of a feat). Really without going into great detail, i will say i truly believe that there is something to learn and positive habits (and negative habits) to take from both riding a bike in platforms and clipless.

**LostBoyScout** · 06-02-2003, 08:50 PM

Clipless allow you to pull up which uses different muscles on your body so you can spread the workload over a broader range of muscles. Your respitory system will never see the difference. As for 'spinning circles', both work exactly the same well, provided the person knows how to pedal well. So yes there are some performance gains though I think many make it out to be more of a gain then it is.

You LOSE ability to bunnyhop and maneuvre the bike, and I just find flats way more fun so that's why I use em

**indieboy** · 06-02-2003, 08:53 PM

Originally posted by Skookum
Not true...... I used to think that as well, it's just a matter of knowing HOW to pedal flats.
My friend busted his knee up and had to switch to flats and still outpedals me up the hills (not that's much of a feat). Really without going into great detail, i will say i truly believe that there is something to learn and positive habits (and negative habits) to take from both riding a bike in platforms and clipless.

there are! however for xc riding/racing you need the ability to pull up on the pedals like LBS mentioned w/ a great deal of force in some situations. and w/ out clipless this can not be done.

**Serial Midget** · 06-02-2003, 08:55 PM

Originally posted by LostBoyScout
You LOSE ability to bunnyhop and maneuvre the bike, and I just find flats way more fun so that's why I use em

I never had that ability so I won't miss it...

**Skookum** · 06-02-2003, 09:00 PM

Originally posted by indieboy
there are! however for xc riding/racing you need the ability to pull up on the pedals like LBS mentioned w/ a great deal of force in some situations. and w/ out clipless this can not be done.

This can be done just hang out with LostBoyScout and i'm sure he will prove it to you..................
me i cant bunny hop for crap either way......

**indieboy** · 06-02-2003, 09:07 PM

Originally posted by Skookum
This can be done just hang out with LostBoyScout and i'm sure he will prove it to you..................
me i cant bunny hop for crap either way......

pulling up as in pulling up w/ your foot....if you aren't riding clipless pedals there's nothing to hold your foot to the pedal when you try to pull up. ask SM or any one else that rides on the road or rides xc alot and ask them how much power they are able to generate on their upstroke from clipless pedals.....

**Skookum** · 06-02-2003, 09:25 PM

Originally posted by indieboy
pulling up as in pulling up w/ your foot....if you aren't riding clipless pedals there's nothing to hold your foot to the pedal when you try to pull up. ask SM or any one else that rides on the road or rides xc alot and ask them how much power they are able to generate on their upstroke from clipless pedals.....

Case in point, Rider:Oly.... Approach slow, sure he's using his suspension for some of the spring here but also this is a 40 plus pound bike, i've seen tons of people get the same lift on hardtails that wiegh 30 plus. Note the feet firmly and surely placed upon the platforms.... The difference here is all body english, not "cheating" and using lift exclusively the legs. One of the bad points of clipless it takes you away from fundamentals of technical bikey ability.......

**Skookum** · 06-02-2003, 09:29 PM

I ride clipless and flats and i know you cannot rely on your upstroke, but c'mon who really does exclusively for any extended period of time. I do on a long ardous climb just to distribute the work a little bit and give some muscles a break. But ultimately the ability to "spin" can be accomplished with both.

**Serial Midget** · 06-02-2003, 10:17 PM

I am not likely to do North Shore stylie stunts or take huge gaps on my XC hardtail - it's for going up trails as fast as possible and for this I need clipless. You might be able to climb well on fire roads on flats (steady cadence) but on the trail (variable cadence) the clipless have a significant advantage in power transfer. This is not due to the pedals alone but also has a lot to do with rigid soled shoes.

Riding at speed on a road bike without clipless is just plain silly.