can we pretty much kiss our military's credibility goodbye?

[$tinkle]

reminiscent of july 2002 in afghanistan:BAGHDAD, Iraq - A U.S. helicopter fired on a wedding party early Wednesday in western Iraq, killing more than 40 people, Iraqi officials said. The U.S. military said it could not confirm the report and was investigating.

Lt. Col Ziyad al-Jbouri, deputy police chief of the city of Ramadi, said between 42 and 45 people died in the attack, which took place about 2:45 a.m. in a remote desert area near the border with Syria and Jordan. He said those killed included 15 children and 10 women.

AP (http://news.bostonherald.com/international/view.bg?articleid=28538)i don't even know where to start with this. :mad:

[N8]

What the...????


When was this?

[Westy]

Sh1tty mistake. Prepare for the retaliations.

We've really screwed the pooch on this one. No good solution to it either.

[N8]

Iraqis interviewed on the videotape said partygoers had fired into the air in a traditional wedding celebration. American troops have sometimes mistaken celebratory gunfire for hostile fire.



When are they gonna learn..????

:(

[$tinkle]

Originally posted by Westy
Sh1tty mistake. Prepare for the retaliations.

We've really screwed the pooch on this one. No good solution to it either. you know what else? this could very well be the tipping point the kerry camp may need. Not to accuse them of "celebrating" this, i'm just saying bush may be putting little W stickers on the stuff he wants to take with him next january.

[Serial Midget]

Originally posted by N8
When are they gonna learn..????

:(

When are WHO going to learn? Obviously we are not learning anything over there. Bush has taken our country to level we have never seen before. :(

[Westy]

Originally posted by Serial Midget
When are WHO going to learn? Obviously we are not learning anything over there. Bush has taken our country to level we have never seen before. :(


It was clearly the wedding parties fault. We have brought them freedom and with freedom you get mowed down by a gunship for firing a weapon. That is why guns are so rare in the US.

[BurlyShirley]

Originally posted by Serial Midget
When are WHO going to learn? Obviously we are not learning anything over there. Bush has taken our country to level we have never seen before. :(

"Hello, pilot?"

"Yes, pilot here"

"Pilot, this is George W. Bush, thats right, the commander in chief"

"How can i help you Mr. President?"

"Pilot, you see that wedding party over there?"


I bet thats exactly how it went:rolleyes:

[T-Dog]

Oh my sweet gentle jesus-just when you think it can't get worse.......the UN has got to get involved- there has to be some multi-national troops sent in to help get some confidence and cred back.

[I Are Baboon]

Ugh, it's one bad thing after another. :dead: :(

[Serial Midget]

That is pathetic for even you. This is George's War and he is the Commander in Chief - that's where the buck stops. The policies and action of the administration put us into a situation where things like this are bound to happen. George must take responsibility for the good as well as the bad - his policies put us there in the first place.

Originally posted by BurlySurly
"Hello, pilot?"

"Yes, pilot here"

"Pilot, this is George W. Bush, thats right, the commander in chief"

"How can i help you Mr. President?"

"Pilot, you see that wedding party over there?"


I bet thats exactly how it went:rolleyes:

[Westy]

Originally posted by BurlySurly
"Hello, pilot?"

"Yes, pilot here"

"Pilot, this is George W. Bush, thats right, the commander in chief"

"How can i help you Mr. President?"

"Pilot, you see that wedding party over there?"


I bet thats exactly how it went:rolleyes:

I think he messed it up when he said "Let's find a reason to invade Iraq".

[Tenchiro]

Originally posted by I Are Baboon
Ugh, it's one bad thing after another. :dead: :(

Well it is a war afterall.

[I Are Baboon]

Originally posted by Tenchiro
Well it is a war afterall.

And the USA is looking like CHAMPS lately! :thumb:

:rolleyes:

[BurlyShirley]

Originally posted by Serial Midget
That is pathetic for even you. This is George's War and he is the Commander in Chief - that's where the buck stops. The policies and action of the administration put us into a situation where things like this are bound to happen. George must take responsibility for the good as well as the bad - his policies put us there in the first place.

G-zus!

Its a war for chrissakes, and in war (and as you said) things like this are 'bound' to happen. The intentions of this whole thing (i believe) are good. Whether or not that will be the end result remains to be seen, but i have confidence that we'll get the job done. Every time some incompetant pilot blows up some people at a wedding party you cant go second guessing the entire plan because of one unfortunate event. It sucks, but its war. As we've been saying, Saddam killed that many people all the time.

[golgiaparatus]

What kind of a jackass pilot vaporizes a wedding party? I swear some of our soldiers should not be put in charge of deadly weapons, phucking morons.

[Tenchiro]

Found this on Page 53, it is about the Afghan wedding bombing.

http://www.ridemonkey.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=23842

[bomberz1qr20]

Originally posted by Westy
It was clearly the wedding parties fault. We have brought them freedom and with freedom you get mowed down by a gunship for firing a weapon. That is why guns are so rare in the US.

Um...

I...

:confused:

[Westy]

Originally posted by bomberz1qr20
Um...

I...

:confused:

Did I really need a :sarcasm: for that one, or I have I stopped making any sense lately?

In my own little world I am hilarioulsy sarcastic:monkey:. More than likely I just need to be medicated.

[bomberz1qr20]

Originally posted by BurlySurly
Every time some incompetant pilot blows up some people at a wedding party you cant go second guessing the entire plan because of one unfortunate event. It sucks, but its war. As we've been saying, Saddam killed that many people all the time.

We SHOULD question the entire operation - it's patriotic to do so.

Why are we there? What do we have to gain by giving Iraq it's freedom? Why can't they sort out their own bulls*it? Why don't we go after ALL the dicatators in the world? Why are we focusing on this hellhole?

I think we all know why, Cheney wants a new pair of shoes.

And by your logic above, Saddam killing people all the time means we are allowed the occasional wedding party hit? Uh...ok.




:rolleyes:

[Tenchiro]

Originally posted by Westy
Did I really need a :sarcasm: for that one, or I have I stopped making any sense lately?

In my own little world I am hilarioulsy sarcastic:monkey:. More than likely I just need to be medicated.

Hey now, I take my freedom to be mowed down in a hail of gunfire very seriously. I don't appreciate people makinglight of that. :angry:

[LordOpie]

Originally posted by BurlySurly
Every time some incompetant pilot blows up some people at a wedding party...
Every time... hahahaahah. Good stuff :D

PS: I've decided to become an insensitive @sshole... absurd stuff really gets me laughing. Maybe I should post another pic to piss people off?

[Westy]

Originally posted by Tenchiro
Hey now, I take my freedom to be mowed down in a hail of gunfire very seriously. I don't appreciate people makinglight of that. :angry:

I am sorry that I have offended you. Please let us know when we can slaughter you and your family.

[Tenchiro]

Originally posted by Westy
I am sorry that I have offended you. Please let us know when we can slaughter you and your family.

Should I send that request to president@whitehouse.gov?

[$tinkle]

Originally posted by LordOpie
PS: I've decided to become an insensitive @sshole... absurd stuff really gets me laughing. Maybe I should post another pic to piss people off? you won't do itOriginally posted by Tenchiro
Should I send that request to president@whitehouse.gov?you won't either

[BurlyShirley]

Originally posted by bomberz1qr20
We SHOULD question the entire operation - it's patriotic to do so.
: :rolleyes:

What I mean is, this event should not change your perception of the situation. This is a side effect of the overall solution. If youre against it, fine, be against it, but the fact that some dumbass pilot blew up a wedding party in a war is no reason to cast blame on GWB or newly question the motives of the entire campaign. It was a mistake. They happen.

Have summa these:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes::rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

[jimmydean]

We are looking real good at this point, real good. I know it's a war, but at what point do we stop to look at what we are doing?

So the transfer of power is in 6 weeks, yet they say there may be as many as 125,000 US soldiers remaining there until late 2005. Where do they think these troops are going to come from?

The impact this war has had on our military will be felt for a long time as it is. More people are getting out now than ever and recruiting will see an all time low. We will run out of people to send over there, then when we are done, there will be nobody left to send ANYWHERE.

I can't be the only one who sees this? I may see more than most because I hear about recruiting figures all day, but does anyone else see this?

[Westy]

Originally posted by BurlySurly
G-zus!

Its a war for chrissakes, and in war (and as you said) things like this are 'bound' to happen.

The intentions of this whole thing (i believe) are good. Whether or not that will be the end result remains to be seen, but i have confidence that we'll get the job done.

Every time some incompetant pilot blows up some people at a wedding party you cant go second guessing the entire plan because of one unfortunate event. It sucks, but its war. As we've been saying, Saddam killed that many people all the time.

1: This really is not a war, this is an occupation. We are using a hammer to push in thumbtacks.

2: Intentions may be good but the basis of the whole thing were horribly misconcieved and misinterpreted. No WMD's, no Iraqis waving flags welcoming us, no foreign terrorists. Yes we got rid of Saddam but we have also created a huge breeding and recruiting grounds for terrorist.

3: If it is OK to kill as many people as Saddam did, why didn't we just leave him in charge?

Edit:
But like I said before, now that we started it we have to finish it.
But the Military is build around killing the enemy, not building a country and keeping the peace. The whole idea was bad and Bush should take the blame.

[LordOpie]

so I finally read the article... uhh, at the moment, it's just an accusation from Iraqis at the scene. The US needs to investigate cuz it sounded like there weren't even sure there was a bird in the area?

Plus, the testimony is coming from people at a wedding -- I'm sure there was drinking -- and it happened at 3am.

So far, we need to wait and learn more cuz I've seen all sorts of weird stuff at 3am after drinking for six hours.

[Westy]

Originally posted by LordOpie
so I finally read the article... uhh, at the moment, it's just an accusation from Iraqis at the scene. The US needs to investigate cuz it sounded like there weren't even sure there was a bird in the area?

Plus, the testimony is coming from people at a wedding -- I'm sure there was drinking -- and it happened at 3am.

So far, we need to wait and learn more cuz I've seen all sorts of weird stuff at 3am after drinking for six hours.

Prolly a Muslim wedding, I doubt there was much drinking going on.

[LordOpie]

Originally posted by Westy
Prolly a Muslim wedding, I doubt there was much drinking going on.
ok, fine, but the point still remains that there's currently unfounded accusations by people who were witnesses at 3am and *might* have an agenda counter to ours.

I'm just saying, let's learn more before hanging more military peeps.

[Westy]

Originally posted by LordOpie
ok, fine, but the point still remains that there's currently unfounded accusations by people who were witnesses at 3am and *might* have an agenda counter to ours.

I'm just saying, let's learn more before hanging more military peeps.

Agweed.

[$tinkle]

Originally posted by Westy
No WMD's, no Iraqis waving flags welcoming us, no foreign terrorists.dude?

[Serial Midget]

Originally posted by LordOpie
ok, fine, but the point still remains that there's currently unfounded accusations by people who were witnesses at 3am and *might* have an agenda counter to ours.

I'm just saying, let's learn more before hanging more military peeps.

Shirley is the one hanging the military - the rest of us are hanging Bush and you are calling Iraqis a bunch of drunks with guns...

[$tinkle]

Originally posted by Serial Midget
Shirley is the one hanging the military - the rest of us are hanging Bush and you are calling Iraqis a bunch of drunks with guns... i have relatives in iraq?? :confused:

[LordOpie]

Originally posted by Serial Midget
you are calling Iraqis a bunch of drunks with guns...
Iraqis? I thought we were talking about a N8 party?

[Silver]

What's the story? Some pilot will get his ass handed to him, and Bush won't find out about it, because no one will tell him.

He doesn't read the papers, remember.

[$tinkle]

Originally posted by Silver
What's the story? Some pilot will get his ass handed to him, and Bush won't find out about it, because no one will tell him.

He doesn't read the papers, remember. yes, because certainly the NYT, Boston Globe, the Guardian, & USA Today have never been embroiled in controversy regarding Iraq.

curiously tangnetial: aljazeera (http://www.aljazeera.com/fn758.asp) has yet to report this story, & this site pushes updates every second (if you let them)

[bomberz1qr20]

Originally posted by Serial Midget
Burly Surly is the one hanging out with the military bondage and S&M squad - the rest of us are hanging Bush and you are calling his daughters a couple of drunks with guns...

Agreed.

:thumb:

[T-Dog]

Originally posted by Serial Midget
When are WHO going to learn? Obviously we are not learning anything over there. Bush has taken our country to level we have never seen before. :(

Yes, he has- with the approval of the majority of congress. What I'd like to see is some of our elected reps working on solutions and ideas for cleaning up the mess......I haven't heard Kerry offer one decent plan for Iraq. Seems to me that congress should be working on fixing, not blaming. I'm sure Kerry's gleefully rubbing his hands together over this one, but he seems to have forgotten that he is still employed as a Senator. If he's so damn smart and should replace Bush, then why not get his ass back to the capitol and come up with some solutions? I think the situation warrants a special congressional session....

[N8]

Originally posted by Serial Midget
Shirley is the one hanging the military - the rest of us are hanging Bush and you are calling Iraqis a bunch of drunks with guns...


I blame Clinton for not taking care of Saddam instead of enjoying his frequent BJ sessions with ugly chicks.

[LordOpie]

Originally posted by N8
I blame Clinton for not taking care of Saddam instead of enjoying his frequent BJ sessions with ugly chicks.
I blame Bush Sr for not finishing the job... so there :blah:

[Westy]

Originally posted by N8
I blame Clinton for not taking care of Saddam instead of enjoying his frequent BJ sessions with ugly chicks.


If we are back passing the buck here GHB should have taken care of him instead of pandering to the Arab $$ and oil we received for Desert Storm.

[bomberz1qr20]

Originally posted by N8
I blame Clinton for not taking care of Saddam instead of enjoying his frequent BJ sessions with ugly chicks.

Don't drag your mom into this discussion.

:eek:

[N8]

Originally posted by LordOpie
I blame Bush Sr for not finishing the job... so there :blah:

I blame Clinton for blowing smoke up the American Public's a$$ resulting in him beating Bush Sr in the election and depriving him of the opportunity to take out Saddam in the mid 90's.

[N8]

Originally posted by bomberz1qr20
Don't drag your mom into this discussion.

:eek:

My mom passed away in 1985....

But thanks for the sentiment.

[LordOpie]

Originally posted by N8
I blame Clinton for blowing smoke up the American Public's a$$ resulting in him beating Bush Sr in the election and depriving him of the opportunity to take out Saddam in the mid 90's.
are you bored? i mean, it's no 4:20p yet, so :confused:

[N8]

Originally posted by LordOpie
are you bored? i mean, it's no 4:20p yet, so :confused:

Nah... just proving how stupid it is to blame everything on the President... past or present.

[bomberz1qr20]

Originally posted by N8
My mom passed away in 1985....

But thanks for the sentiment.

My bad, sorry. Really.


I need to ask questions before the mom jokes, no real offense intended here.


:monkey:

[LordOpie]

Originally posted by N8
Nah... just proving how stupid it is to blame everything on the President... past or present.
oh I'm so friggin' gonna hold you to that the next time a dem holds office!

[$tinkle]

now i don't know what to think:BAGHDAD, Iraq (CNN) -- Pentagon officials Wednesday denied alleged eyewitness reports of a U.S. attack on a wedding party in a remote area of western Iraq that killed innocent civilians.

He added, "We had actionable intelligence to go after a foreign fighters' safe house. It is not our belief that there was a wedding party in the open desert."

cnn breakin' ya off some (http://www.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/meast/05/19/iraq.main/index.html)this could go either way - i'm cautiously pessimistic, however.

[Serial Midget]

Well it looks like George Bush might just save the day. :thumb:

[Serial Midget]

Originally posted by bomberz1qr20
My bad, sorry. Really.


I need to ask questions before the mom jokes, no real offense intended here.


:monkey:

N8 pulling a Johnny Fairplay... :monkey:

[narlus]

Originally posted by Serial Midget
Shirley is the one hanging the military - the rest of us are hanging Bush and you are calling Iraqis a bunch of drunks with guns...

drunks with guns...the finest band to ever emerge from st louis (not counting uncle tupelo, they just relocated there).

they even presaged mike hutchence's death:

"i got my dick in one hand...and a rope in the other"

[Westy]

Originally posted by $tinkle
now i don't know what to think:this could go either way - i'm cautiously pessimistic, however.

Hopefully this was not a wedding party, but the P.R. damage is already done. Maybe the military should do clean up raids to take out the yellow journalists who flock to the scene.

[BostonBullit]

Originally posted by Westy
If we are back passing the buck here GHB should have taken care of him instead of pandering to the Arab $$ and oil we received for Desert Storm.

actually GHB (isn't that a date rape drug?) and Stormin Norman wanted to finish it all off, it was the panzies in the pastel blue helmets that made the coalition forces stop like 150mi short of baghdad.

You know what a large group of enemy soldiers firing weapons looks like through FLIR? a bunch of white dots on a gray background.

You know what a large group of people firing weapons at a wedding party looks like through FLIR? a bunch of white dots on a gray background.


but that being said, I don't believe random "eyewitnesses" from Iraq and I don't believe the military either. I don't now, and will never, have enough verifyable information to make an accurate assesment so I'm going to go eat a donut.

[$tinkle]

Originally posted by narlus
drunks with guns...the finest band to ever emerge from st louiswhat 'bout The Urge?

[N8]

To answer your original question of "can we pretty much kiss our military's credibility goodbye?"


No, but we can definitely pretty much kiss what's left of our media's credibility goodbye.




:monkey:

[Tenchiro]

A quick update, everything is ok folks. It was a "bad person" wedding. Damn the liberal media for inferring any wrongdoing on the part of the US!

Videotape shows revelers at celebration (http://msnbc.msn.com/id/5045772/)

The Associated Press
Updated: 9:49 p.m. ET May 23, 2004

RAMADI, Iraq - The bride arrives in a white pickup truck and is quickly ushered into a house by a group of women. Outside, men recline on brightly colored silk pillows, relaxing on the carpeted floor of a large goat-hair tent as boys dance to tribal songs.

The videotape obtained Sunday by Associated Press Television News captures a wedding party that survivors say was later attacked by U.S. planes early Wednesday, killing up to 45 people. The dead included the cameraman, Yasser Shawkat Abdullah, hired to record the festivities, which ended Tuesday night before the planes struck.

The U.S. military says it is investigating the attack, which took place in the village of Mogr el-Deeb about five miles from the Syrian border, but that all evidence so far indicates the target was a safehouse for foreign fighters.

“There was no evidence of a wedding: no decorations, no musical instruments found, no large quantities of food or leftover servings one would expect from a wedding celebration,” Brig. Gen. Mark Kimmitt said Saturday. “There may have been some kind of celebration. Bad people have celebrations, too.”

But video that APTN shot a day after the attack shows fragments of musical instruments, pots and pans and brightly colored beddings used for celebrations, scattered around the bombed out tent.

LINK (http://msnbc.msn.com/id/5045772/)

[Westy]

So it was an Evil Wedding?

http://www.byreconly.com/images/MiniWedding/Ventriloquist_sm.jpg

[llkoolkeg]

:D