More overclocking...

[binary visions]

Well, my girlfriend spent the day on Saturday and part of Sunday making a scrapbook for her brother, so I spent a lot of time watching the Simpsons and overclocking my computer.

Previously, my BIOS was very limited in overclocking options. I could change the multiplier and the clock speed, but that was it.

My latest BIOS upgrade delivered a number of delicious overclocking options unto me. Most importantly, I now have control over the CPU/RAM speed ratio, and have a lock for my PCIe. I also have a ton of other options which I haven't explored fully, but am unlikely to do so as I don't need to squeeze every last mhz out of my CPU, I just want a performance increase and something to putter around with.

My CPU is a 1.8ghz Athlon 64 Winchester core, stock multiplier and clock speed set at 9x200. My last overclocking efforts gave me a limit of 248x8.5, or 2108mhz. Any higher than that and I started getting memory errors - my guess was that it was due to the memory running outside of its limits.

Turns out, I was right - my latest BIOS upgrade provides dynamic numbers as to what speed everything is running at. I had my budget DDR400 running at 496mhz - oops. No wonder it started taking a dump when I ran it higher.

Dug into the BIOS and set the multiplier back to 9x, and left the clock alone. I dropped the CPU/RAM ratio down to 2/1.5 to take the RAM out of the equation as a limiting factor.

I did a bunch of testing and got up to 9x267, or 2403mhz, before deciding to call it a day. Before I was done, though, I decided to tweak my RAM a bit, so I bumped up the ratio to 2/1.66. The tests ran fine but when I tried booting Motherboard Monitor in Windows, my system would freeze. I dropped the clock speed down to 265, and everything worked fine. Ran Prime95 all night last night with no errors or stability problems - and the temp never got about 40* C.

I'm done testing for now, but if I get bored I might try some more tweaking. The low temperature indicates that I could easily go higher, but testing is a long tedious process (memory test takes ~20min. for one pass, I like to let it run 2 passes, and Prime95 should run for at least an hour for in between tests, and ~12 hours or more for final stability tests), and I'm satisfied for the time being.

Final result: 2385mhz, an overclock of 32.5%. Not too shabby at all! I'd like to get my hands on one of those 2.2ghz 3500+ chips that Echo just bought, if I could squeeze 32.5% out of that, I'd be up at almost 3ghz. Probably need a better cooling solution, though.

[BikeGeek]

(edit: removed my babble from a very informative thread)

[Pau11y]

BV, is the memory tests in Prime?

[binary visions]

BV, is the memory tests in Prime?
No, I run an on-boot memory scanner (memtest86 I think it was called), since that's the only way you can actually get ahold of the majority of your memory to test it.

Prime95 has a test that will test your memory but I wouldn't rely on it. It's much better for stress testing your CPU.

[binary visions]

How are your overclocking exploits going, anyway, pau11y?

[Pau11y]

Kewl, thanx for that. One more thing, I'm sitting on an Opteron 165 and I'm trying to kick it to another level. Do you have a good page on AMD o/c-ing to where I can figure out what all these settings in my BIOS do? I think I'm not getting something right...HT freq, HT width, voltages...ect. I'm bottlenecked at around 2000 mhz w/ good ram and I know these processors can go at least 2.4 on stock voltage/cooling. Maybe H8R can chime in on this too...

[binary visions]

I don't have any of my links at work and am not sure any of them will be useful to you anyway since they're just an overview of the O/C process - I stumbled through most of it myself.

Does your BIOS have a PCI-e lock and seperate adjustments for the memory speed? Those two things will bottleneck you right off the line. If you can't lock your PCI-e bus and you can't set your memory speed seperately (or at least reduce the CPU/RAM ratio), everything will grind to a halt.

What's going on? Are you getting errors or is the machine refusing to boot?

[Pau11y]

Ok, here's the list of the Neo4:
PCI-E lock - yes, set at 100 mhz (will tweak w/ that and voltage later)
CPU FSB: stock at 9x200. I'm going to try and drop the multiplier as I go up. I got it to go stable a 210mhz at 9.
I've also slowed the HT multiplier from 5x to 4x and the width from 16 up/ 16 down to 8 up/ 8 down.

First things first tho... memory. I want to make sure that's satisfied before I start messing w/ the CPU.
Seperate memory clock/bus - yes
Got the mem to go 250mhz at a much slower timing: 3-4-4-6.
I'm going to try and push her a bit more... 265 or so...and then speed it back up bit by bit.

Paully

Edit: the CPU is a Opteron 165 Toledo core w/ the E6 stepping. Memory is the Corsair XLM 2x512 at 2-2-2-5.

[binary visions]

Why are you running your RAM so slow?

I wouldn't do the memory first. I'd do the CPU, with the RAM set conservatively, then work on the memory. If you want to eliminate your motherboard as the limiting factor, push your multiplier way down and start incrementing the clock speed. That'll let you find the max clock speed for the computer. You can proceed with the multiplier from there.

RAM is generally the most flakey part of overclocking. Trying to set that first is asking for a headache.

[Pau11y]

Actually, change that. I have 4 sticks in, at 2T timing; 4x512.
The reason I'm dealing w/ the ram first is just that, they're the bottleneck of any overclocking effort. Once I establish the limit of the memory, I'll operate w/in those confines. But like I said, the memory controls are entirely seperate of the CPU and display controls.
I just pulled the MemTest86+ and will do a baseline w/ stock clock to make sure it's 100% before I start going off :D

[H8R]

Actually, change that. I have 4 sticks in, at 2T timing; 4x512.
The reason I'm dealing w/ the ram first is just that, they're the bottleneck of any overclocking effort. Once I establish the limit of the memory, I'll operate w/in those confines. But like I said, the memory controls are entirely seperate of the CPU and display controls.
I just pulled the MemTest86+ and will do a baseline w/ stock clock to make sure it's 100% before I start going off :D

I read most of the thread so far, can you give me the cliff notes of your current settings? I didn't see any mention of core or memory voltage.

[H8R]

Why are you running your RAM so slow?

I wouldn't do the memory first. I'd do the CPU, with the RAM set conservatively, then work on the memory.

:stupid:




We need a new smiley that say's "I'm with uber-smart guy"

[binary visions]

But like I said, the memory controls are entirely seperate of the CPU and display controls.

That contradicts this:

The reason I'm dealing w/ the ram first is just that, they're the bottleneck of any overclocking effort. Once I establish the limit of the memory, I'll operate w/in those confines.

If you have control of the two seperately, why would the RAM bottleneck the processor overclock?

[Pau11y]

I read most of the thread so far, can you give me the cliff notes of your current settings? I didn't see any mention of core or memory voltage.

Core voltage: 1.4v + 6.6%
Memory: 2.7v
I've slowed the memory down to 3-4-4-7 and got 'er up to 250mhz...trying to get to ~ 265 or so and then will start to speed it back up... 3-4-4-6, 3-4-4-5...ect
The CPU I had left at 9x and started to tweak w/ the FSB... stable at 210, won't boot at 220. So, I'm going to drop the 9x and slowly bump the FSB from 210.
But first, I'm going to get a good baseline for memory at stock speeds to make sure I have good memory (200mhz @ 2-2-2-5). I have 4 sticks in there so it's running at 2T timing.

BV, you're right. They should have nothing to do w/ each other. After I get the baseline done, I'll mess w/ the CPU w/ the ram at stock speeds. Thanx.

Paully

[binary visions]

Ohh, I gotcha - you're setting the RAM speed independant of your multiplier. That 250mhz is actually 500mhz since there's a RAM multiplier of 2. Was trying to figure out why you were having trouble running your 400mhz RAM at 250mhz :p

You're pushing the RAM pretty hard... You said the timings were good on it, have you read anything about how friendly it is to overclocking? Frankly, I'm suprised my RAM even worked at 496mhz (248x2), since it was budget PQI. Some RAM isn't really friendly to overclocking, even some of the good stuff.

[H8R]

The CPU I had left at 9x and started to tweak w/ the FSB... stable at 210, won't boot at 220. So, I'm going to drop the 9x and slowly bump the FSB from 210.


Bump the voltage to 1.475 (or maybe even 1.5), then slowly start the mhz bumping. Can you go at 1mhz increments? The Opteron may need the extra voltage push to stay stable if you push the clock. Watch your temps!!

What mobo is this on? You temps and such may be fine on the CPU, etc but the NB and SB might be cooking.

[H8R]

You're pushing the RAM pretty hard... You said the timings were good on it, have you read anything about how friendly it is to overclocking?

What sticks are these?

I think that's a decent speed for 4 X 512. Are they all the same chips?

[Pau11y]

I got them because they're "overclocker friendly". They're being baselined right now. Yeah, sorry about the confusing numbers. The POST screen did show DDR500 when I started up. I'll see if I can push them a bit more once the MemTest is done (I think 265 is the next jump...?). It's funny tho, in the MemTest, it's matching the memory bus speed to the CPU bus speed... I had left my CPU FSB at 9x210 and the memory at 200 - 2-2-2-5. But in MemTest, it's showing DDR420...hummm...
So, I think 2 passes for a good baseline will do before I start going off

[Pau11y]

What sticks are these?

I think that's a decent speed for 4 X 512. Are they all the same chips?

Yeah, they're all the same stuff: matched Corsair XLM 512mb sticks.
As for the temps, I have aftermarket cooling (air) on it. But just in case, I've loaded Everest so I can track the temps.

Sidenote: bummer Everest Home edition is being discontinued! If any of yaz need a copy, let me know.

12 mins in, 36% done on 2048mb of memory...

Edit: the MoBo is a MSI K8N Neo4 SLI. There's cooling on the NB. I'm not sure where the SB is tho. And yeah, there's 1mhz increments on this board

[binary visions]

Motherboard monitor does a good job of monitoring temps and voltages and such.

Yeah, the memory test takes a while, especially if you let it do two passes. Takes a bit less than 20 minutes per pass to do my 1gb.

[Pau11y]

I don't know why, but everytime I see H8R's avatar, I want to dust it down w/ a bottle of talc powder and let it rip down one of those plastic kiddy corkscrew slides you find on the playgrounds... :D

[H8R]

Motherboard monitor does a good job of monitoring temps and voltages and such.

Yeah, the memory test takes a while, especially if you let it do two passes. Takes a bit less than 20 minutes per pass to do my 1gb.

Tha mobo I'm RMAing is too new to show up in MBM. It comes with a nice software monitor of it's own though. All in all a great board except for the bad slots. And they aren't completely bad - I can jiggle the RAM around enough to get it to boot, then it errors out at the splash page.

GRR.

What annoys me is you can look at temps and voltage in the BIOS, in MBM, Speedfan, Sandra, etc and get wildly different numbers. Speedfan reported my CPU as 170 degrees C. :help:

[H8R]

I don't know why, but everytime I see H8R's avatar, I want to dust it down w/ a bottle of talc powder and let it rip down one of those plastic kiddy corkscrew slides you find on the playgrounds... :D

Or slather it with crisco and play "hardwood floor to fireplace hockey"

[binary visions]

What annoys me is you can look at temps and voltage in the BIOS, in MBM, Speedfan, Sandra, etc and get wildly different numbers. Speedfan reported my CPU as 170 degrees C. :help:

Are you sure the individual programs are looking at the correct sensors? There are usually a bunch of sensors on the board and the default temperature sensor in the program isn't always the right one.

When I initially install MBM, it registeres my temp as 71 degrees C. I'm not sure what it's got ahold of there, but it's not a temp sensor. Probably a fan sensor or something. Just need to change which sensor it looks at.

[binary visions]

I don't know why, but everytime I see H8R's avatar, I want to dust it down w/ a bottle of talc powder and let it rip down one of those plastic kiddy corkscrew slides you find on the playgrounds... :D
It's more fun to dust it and let it rip up one of the corkscrew slides. If you get enough body english into the pitch, you can really get some distance when it comes out the top.

[Pau11y]

It's more fun to dust it and let it rip up one of the corkscrew slides. If you get enough body english into the pitch, you can really get some distance when it comes out the top.

Yeah, I don't want to hurt the thing, even if it does have 9 lives :D
But nice visual tho!

[Pau11y]

Ok, 2.75 passes (2.5 hours) into the ram test and I got 2 errors. BUT, just found out that I'm undercooking the ram... should be at 2.75v, and I've got mine at 2.70v, and slightly overclocked. This is prob what caused the errors.

Edit: update on the O/C-ing... at 8.5x multiplier, the FSB is at 235mhz = 2.0 ghz. Interestingly enough, I had thought the memory bus was seperate. But looking at Everest reports, my memory FSB isn't at the setting of 200 as I had set it, it's at 222mhz (DDR444). So, I slowed 'er down to 2.5-3-3-6, just to be safe. I also reversed a case fan to blow air into the case, directly over the CPU and got the temp down another 5 degrees. This case has a scoop to direct the incoming air down onto the CPU cooler fan, as well as blowing across the CPU heat sink. CPU core is at 1.44-6v, memory was set at 2.75v.
Another weird thing I noticed is Prime95 doesn't make use of my cpu 100%, only uses 50%. I wonder if that's related to the dual core...?

Edit II: Ok, so apparently the key in my case is related to CPU vCore. At the above voltage, I was able to take it back up to 9x250 for a 2.25ghz (25% o/c'd), from a 1.8. I slowed the memory to 2.5-3-3-5. The ideal memory voltage (per the manufacturer) is 2.75, 0.5 above what's recommended in BIOS. For a crash test, I use Prime95 AND DVD Shrink to rip Batman Beginnings using AnyDVD in the background. It pegs the CPU at 95 - 100% for about 25 mins. Temps are at 48 degrees loaded like this, and 40 idle. I've got another fan from a Gateway server that moves more air, but is louder, I may try next to drop the temp a couple of more degrees. I'm going to shoot for 2.4ghz, and under 50 degrees loaded. We'll see how that goes... A lot of ppl are getting Opteron 165s into the 2.6s. But I think most are using water cooling.

Edit III: This concludes Pau11yz o/c session. I did get to 2.4 at 3-3-3-6 and 47 degrees loaded case open (did the fan swap - slightly noisier). But at about 4 mins into the 100% stress load, it blue screened on me. So, I settled for 50mhz less and lightly speedier ram of 2.5-3-3-5 at the same temp case closed. It's ripping now and I'll do the torture test tonight (but it's only running at 50% cpu load - I like to get my hands on the old Seti@home as that pegs a cpu at 100%). Not bad for the cheapy 1.8 w/ full 1mb of L2 on both cores :D
- final vcore: 1.44v
- final ram: 2.75v
- final loaded temp: 48 degrees case completely seal'd up (haven't seen the idle, but should be around 40C)
- Rip time dropped from 33 mins to about 20 for Batman Beginnings (GOD DAMN! that's fast compared to my old PIIIs 1ghzs)
- 30.6% increase in CPU speed, but slight decrease in RAM speed from 2-2-2-5 to 2.5-3-3-5

[H8R]

Edit III: This concludes Pau11yz o/c session. I did get to 2.4 at 3-3-3-6 and 47 degrees loaded case open (did the fan swap - slightly noisier). But at about 4 mins into the 100% stress load, it blue screened on me. So, I settled for 50mhz less and lightly speedier ram of 2.5-3-3-5 at the same temp case closed. It's ripping now and I'll do the torture test tonight (but it's only running at 50% cpu load - I like to get my hands on the old Seti@home as that pegs a cpu at 100%). Not bad for the cheapy 1.8 w/ full 1mb of L2 on both cores :D
- final vcore: 1.44v
- final ram: 2.75v
- final loaded temp: 48 degrees case completely seal'd up (haven't seen the idle, but should be around 40C)
- Rip time dropped from 33 mins to about 20 for Batman Beginnings (GOD DAMN! that's fast compared to my old PIIIs 1ghzs)
- 30.6% increase in CPU speed, but slight decrease in RAM speed from 2-2-2-5 to 2.5-3-3-5

Hmm. I'm gonna have to go for 2.5 after I get the new mobo. You just threw down the RM OC gauntlet buddy.

:blah:

[binary visions]

Might look into one of these Opteron CPUs as my next upgrade :D

Yes, your Prim95 only using 50% is related to the dual cores. It's in the help file - I think it's the "affinity" option to take advantage of both cores.

Good job :thumb:

[Pau11y]

Now I need to try this on my older box...3500+ and see how far I can push it w/ this new found info :D

[Pau11y]

Might look into one of these Opteron CPUs as my next upgrade :D

Yes, your Prim95 only using 50% is related to the dual cores. It's in the help file - I think it's the "affinity" option to take advantage of both cores.

Good job :thumb:

Gotcha on the affinity. Installed a 2nd instance on the machine and running the full torture test.
My core 0 errored out in 5 mins of running, so I think I'm going to reduce it to 2.3ghz and fly it again. Make you a bet it's related to those couple of errors I got on the MemTest... Methinks mez a going to have to have a chat w/ Corsair about some warranty-ing...

Hum...haven't reduced it yet and she's past the 5 min mark....holding steady at 49 C.

Called Corsair. They recommended 2.80v since I'm running 4 modules.... Going back to MemTest to do more baseline on indiviual modules...oh boy!

[binary visions]

Especially since you're O/Cing the memory, make sure you do a full 24 hour torture test with Prime95. If you really want to hurt it, download CPU Burn as well and run them concurrently.

IMO, if you can't run Prime95 for 24 hours with zero errors, it's not stable enough for me.

Oh, and I let MemTest86 run for 10 passes when I was settled on an overclock, before I called it stable.

[Pau11y]

Especially since you're O/Cing the memory, make sure you do a full 24 hour torture test with Prime95. If you really want to hurt it, download CPU Burn as well and run them concurrently.

IMO, if you can't run Prime95 for 24 hours with zero errors, it's not stable enough for me.

Oh, and I let MemTest86 run for 10 passes when I was settled on an overclock, before I called it stable.

Copy that on the MemTest. I'm just running them individually at stock speeds to get a baseline on errors. I'll prob do like 3 or 4 passes as they're booking right along. Once that's done, I'll do them each o/c'd to get a 2nd baseline at speed. Then I'll do them all together for a final run to see if it errors out. If they do I'll be singing the warranty song :D
Roughly 14.5 min each pass per stick at stock speed...

[H8R]

Might look into one of these Opteron CPUs as my next upgrade :D


Look for the dual core Opteron 165. $300 for a dual core proc w/ TWO 1mb caches.

That is my next upgrade for sure.


http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.aspx?i=2591

[H8R]

download CPU Burn as well and run them concurrently.



:stupid:

Good way to test that HSF too.

:)

[Pau11y]

Look for the dual core Opteron 165. $300 for a dual core proc w/ TWO 1mb caches.

That is my next upgrade for sure.


http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.aspx?i=2591

I paid a bit more... $335. But it was a known good batch/stepping for o/c (E6). I think the $300.00 is for OE from newegg.com w/o HS/F...and I'm not sure about the warranty on them. If they're retail, the sweet deal!

[H8R]

Hmm. I'm gonna have to go for 2.5 after I get the new mobo. You just threw down the RM OC gauntlet buddy.

:blah:

Scratch that. I RMA'd my Biostar board and went for stability and features over OC.

MSI K8NGM2-FID Socket 939 NVIDIA GeForce 6150

Onboard video w/ 128mb of frame buffer, D-sub and DVI output, component video, 4 X SATA II, 7.1 audio, firewire, gigabit ethernet, PCIe X 16 and X1, etc, etc...

The OC functions are not super extensive but it has enough goodies on it to make it do almost anything. It'll end up in later life in an HTPC I think.

[Pau11y]

Scratch that. I RMA'd my Biostar board and went for stability and features over OC.

MSI K8NGM2-FID Socket 939 NVIDIA GeForce 6150

Onboard video w/ 128mb of frame buffer, D-sub and DVI output, component video, 4 X SATA II, 7.1 audio, firewire, gigabit ethernet, PCIe X 16 and X1, etc, etc...

The OC functions are not super extensive but it has enough goodies on it to make it do almost anything. It'll end up in later life in an HTPC I think.

Dude, what form factor is it, full atx? You'll have to post a review of how the vid performance is w/ the onboard. I want to check into chassis for HTPC that can do dual DVD drives (that really nice A-Tec one only does a single slim one and doesn't take MSI MoBos). I think Lian-Li makes a dual ext 5.25 HTPC case...but is kinda fugly.

[H8R]

Dude, what form factor is it, full atx? You'll have to post a review of how the vid performance is w/ the onboard. I want to check into chassis for HTPC that can do dual DVD drives (that really nice A-Tec one only does a single slim one and doesn't take MSI MoBos). I think Lian-Li makes a dual ext 5.25 HTPC case...but is kinda fugly.

Well you're in luck.

It's micro-atx, and it f&ckin cheap considering the video on it. I have the Biostar 6100 board, and the onboard video on that is better then some lower end dedicated cards out there.


The 6150 board have even higher clock speeds and better LAN, firewall, etc. Also it comes with extra bracket for compnent video and sound. It's pretty much the goddamn bees knees for HTPC.

http://www.msicomputer.com/product/mb_image/MS-7207-040.jpg


http://images10.newegg.com/NeweggImage/productimage/13-130-529-02.JPG

And might I suggest this Inwin case. I built a system for my sister with one of their micro atx cases and they have to be the best cheapo cases out there. Really practical and solid. I'd even say better than Antec if they spec'd better PSU's:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16811108347

http://images10.newegg.com/NeweggImage/productimage/11-108-347-01.JPG




Here's the full spec on the mobo:

http://www.msicomputer.com/product/p_spec.asp?model=K8NGM2-FID&class=mb

CPU

• Supports 64-bit AMD® Athlon™ 64FX/64 processor (Socket 939)
• Supports 3000+, 3200+, 3500+, 3800+, 4000+, 4400+, 4600+, 4800+, FX53, FX55, FX57, FX60

Chipset

• NVIDIA ® C51PV (GeForce6150) Chipset
- HyperTransport connection to AMD K8 Athlon64 processor
- 8 or 16 bit control/address/data transfer both directions
- 1GHz "Double Data Rate" operation both direction
- Supports one PCI-E x16 slot
- Graphic integrated

• NVIDIA ® MCP51 (MCP430) Chipset
- Supports dual channel native SATA controller up to 300MB/s with RAID 0, 1, 0+1 and 5
- Ultra DMA 66/100133 master mode PCI EIDE controller
- ACPI & PC2001 compliant enhanced power management
- Supports USB2.0 up to 8 ports
- Supports HD audio

Main Memory

•
Supports dual channel DDR 266/333/400, using four 184-pin DDR DIMMs.
• Supports the memory size up to 4GB
• Supports 2.5v DDR SDRAM DIMM

Slots

• One PCI Express x16 slot
• One PCI Express x1 slot
• Two 32-bit Master 3.3v/5v PCI Bus slots

On-Board IDE/SATA

• An IDE controller on the NVIDIA MPC51 chipset provides IDE HDD/CD-ROM with PIO, Bus Master and Ultra DMA 66/100/133 operation modes, 4X ultra DMA 100/66/33
• Can connect up to 4 IDE

BIOS

• The mainboard BIOS provides "Plug & Play" BIOS which detects the peripheral devices and expansion cards of the board automatically.
• The mainboard provides a Desktop Management Interface (DMI) function which records your mainboard specifications.
• Supports boot from LAN, USB Device 1.1 & 2.0 and SATA HDD

Audio

• 7.1 channel audio codec RealTek ALC880
- Compliance with AC97 v2.3 Spec.
- Meet PC2001 audio performance requirement.

LAN

• VITESSE vsc8201RX
- Compliant with PCI v2.2
- Supports ACPI Power Managment
- Supports 10Mb/s, 100Mb/s or 1000Mb/s (for VSC8201RX only)

IEEE 1394

• Supports two IEEE1394 ports, transfer rate is up to 400Mbps
• Controlled by VIA VT6307 chipset

On-Board Peripherals

- 1 floppy port supports 1 FDD with 360K, 720K, 1.2M, 1.44M and 2.88Mbytes
- 1 VGA port
- 1 DVI port
- 2 IEEE1394 ports (rear x 1 / front x 1)
- 1 parallel port supporting SPP/EPP/ECP mode
- 8 USB2.0 ports (rear x 4 / front x 4)
- 1 Audio (Line-in/Line-Out/MIC) port
- 1 Audio header (Rear/central/side output)
- 1 TV-out header
- 1 RJ-45 LAN Jack
- 2 IDE ports support 4 IDE devices
- 4 serial ATA ports

Dimension
9.61 in (L) x 9.61 in(W) Micro-ATX Form Factor

[H8R]

Some infotainment for Pau11y:


Read:
http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.aspx?i=2548

Then read:
http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.aspx?i=2650

[Pau11y]

Tanx for the info. That o/c from anand was interesting... I need to sit and digest it more.
As for the HT chassis, I'm a bit worried about the 240w PSU driving a system w/ an ATI 9800 Pro among other things. I'm figuring at least a 435w from Enermax or Antec. I'll be using it for more than just HT stuff (hoping to be relocating my ripping chores to the front of the house w/ this rig.

[H8R]

Tanx for the info. That o/c from anand was interesting... I need to sit and digest it more.
As for the HT chassis, I'm a bit worried about the 240w PSU driving a system w/ an ATI 9800 Pro among other things. I'm figuring at least a 435w from Enermax or Antec. I'll be using it for more than just HT stuff (hoping to be relocating my ripping chores to the front of the house w/ this rig.

That PSU is the weak sauce for sure. The Inwin cases are really cool though for the price. I think it'll fit most standard PSU's. Go for the toughness:

http://www.pcpowercooling.com/products/viewproduct.php?show=S41ATX

You can't go wrong there.

[H8R]

Would you consider a studio-quiet 3U rack-mount?

:drool:
http://www.antec.com/us/productDetails.php?ProdID=94003

[Pau11y]

The other thing is the upper vent. In my situation, I have a seperate AC3 decoder because my amp is only "5.1 ready". So w/ the vent, it dictates the location of the HTPC would have to be on top of somfin. It can't be the receiver as it'll melt the PC, and it shouldn't be on the decoder as it's just not that rugged. I may have to get a new TV stand when I do this anyhoo tho so this might be a moot point.

[Discostu]

My current desktop setup is:

MSI K8N Neo 4 Platinum
A64 3000+ Venice Core
4x512 Corsair Value Select
6800gt
Enermax EG-465 FM PSU
XP-90 on the cpu
VF700-CU on the gpu

My day to day overclock is 267 FSB 9x Multiplier 4x HTT 150 Divider ~1.42 vcore.

This gives me 2.4ghz and DDR400 @2.5-3-3-8 with 37C idle and 48C load temps.

I've been able to get this thing into the 2.6ghz range with 1.5v or so but for everyday usage I prefer to play it safe.

Anyone that is having trouble with higher FSB speeds on the nforce 4 boards should make sure that their HTT multiplier is at 3x for testing purposes. HTT speed really affect performance until you get well under 800 mhz.

Also, what are you guys running for power supplies? I was having stability problems until I ditched my 420w Thermaltake with only 18 amps on the 12v rail for a Enermax 460w with 33 amps on the 12v.

[H8R]

Dude, what form factor is it, full atx? You'll have to post a review of how the vid performance is w/ the onboard.

I got it running stable this weekend - vid performance is better than one would expect from an onboard GPU - but nothing to brag about if compared to a dedicated card.

I tested Halo for PC and got a playable 25-30 fps at 1024x768 on "medium" settings. That's damn good for onboard. DVD quality is top-notch.

3DMark 03 score was a measily 1575. This is much better than the ATI X200 though.

I'd equate the 3D performance as on-par with an nVidia 5200 or maybe an ATI 9500.

OC'ing is not this mobo's strong point, but then again it's not aimed at overclockers. There are no adjustments to the vcore settings, and the passive cooling on the chipset consists of a couple of very small heatsinks.

I did manage a stable 2.2ghz with Prime95 and CPU-Burn-In running together 6 hours straight and the temps never went above 46c with the stock cooler running at 1500 rpms. I'm planning longer tests when the machine is not needed by the entire family.

Photoshop, etc load and run hella fast. (how's that for technical..)

One cool feature is the onboard nVidia hardware firewall included in the 6150/430 chipset. I could not get it to work right with my wireless PCI card though, so I disabled it. It works very well with the onboard LAN, and has a slick network management interface via a browser.

[Pau11y]

Wow, totally sounds like a lower end HTPC worthy board! Think that onboard vid can pump out 1080P? I think 1080P is 1920x1080. How's the onboard sound if it has it...?

Edit: I shouldn't say lower end. I meant as a DVD playing PC vs a gaming HTPC.

[H8R]

Wow, totally sounds like a lower end HTPC worthy board! Think that onboard vid can pump out 1080P? I think 1080P is 1920x1080. How's the onboard sound if it has it...?

Edit: I shouldn't say lower end. I meant as a DVD playing PC vs a gaming HTPC.

In the vid settings the slider goes to 2048x1536...I dunno what the output would be for HDTV - I don't have one to test it.

It has DVI and component video out, I do know that. I am using a 21" CRT and it looks beautiful.

Audio is Realtek High Def 7.1

[Pau11y]

In the vid settings the slider goes to 2048x1536...I dunno what the output would be for HDTV - I don't have one to test it.

It has DVI and component video out, I do know that. I am using a 21" CRT and it looks beautiful.

Audio is Realtek High Def 7.1

That onboard vid is perfect then. HDTV is only at 720P (1024x720...?). Your MoBo will do 1080P (1920x1080), but the frequency is questionable. I think most LCDs do it at 60Hz which is plenty good enough for playing DVDs thru the PC. Plus, it's got 7.1, so good sound too. I guess the only other thing an addon card might have over the onboard (sound) is you can pass out the decoded signal into component sound instead of letting the receiver do the decoding and using the SPDIF pass thru (no big tho since 5.1 receivers can be had for around $150.00 these days w/ plenty of power and great sound - 7.1 costs a bit more).
Couple of slim form factor DVD/RWs and it'd be an ideal HTPC, AND you won't have to have a monster of a PSU...435w Enermax should fly just fine. Get everything into passive cooling and it should be whisper quiet :D

Edit: This thread should be sticky'd for future reference.

[H8R]

I guess the only other thing an addon card might have over the onboard (sound) is you can pass out the decoded signal into component sound instead of letting the receiver do the decoding and using the SPDIF pass thru (no big tho since 5.1 receivers can be had for around $150.00 these days w/ plenty of power and great sound - 7.1 costs a bit more).

I think the board has a header for an optional SPDIF output bracket, if that helps.

[H8R]

Ok, here's the torture test I'm running tonight. All the following have been running all at the same time, (even while I type this)

Prime95
CPU Burn-In
Ad-aware SE doing deep scan
1 pass of 3DMark 03 WHILE ALL THE BOVE WERE RUNNING.:help: - Scored 1223. Hey, it finished!


CPU running at 2.4ghz (up from 2.0) - 240mhz HTT X 10 multiplier
Memory running at 218.2 at 2.65v - 3.3.3.8, T1.

No errors so far after 2 hours. I'm gonna try to run Halo CE and Battlefield 2 and see if I can make smoke. :devil:


BTW - CPU temp hasn't gone above 41c and the fan speed has stayed fairly low. (stock cooler)

:thumb: :thumb: :thumb: :thumb:

[binary visions]

Just got caught up on this thread, sounds like you put together a pretty good budget PC, H8R.

I keep thinking about building a HTPC - I always come back to it at the end of the day as a fun project. But I think my money would be spent better elsewhere, considering how little I watch TV or movies these days.

[Pau11y]

Would you consider a studio-quiet 3U rack-mount?

:drool:
http://www.antec.com/us/productDetails.php?ProdID=94003

Yes! This is exactly what I'm talking about! 3U is like about 5.25" tall, which matches a lot of the mid range integrated HT receivers. Throw some feet on the bottom of that box and it'll look bitchin' either sitting in a rack or on a shelf :D

Edit: WOW, $250.00!

[steve45]

Pau11y , you say you have an MSI k8n neo4 sli, i wonder if you could help me out with some of the bios settings?
well i bought the neo4 F version, so i assume the bios settings will be fairly similar if not the same, up until now i was just using MSI CoreCentre to soft clock my A64 3700+ from 2200Mhz to 2442Mhz, but i'd really prefer to do this through the bios, i understand the whole FSB/multipier stuff, but i really not quite sure about the memory side of it, i'm running geil value 1gb(2x 512mb) pc3200, i know this will be a limiting factor in my overclock, i was told to set the divider lower, not sure how to go about doing this though, so was wondering how you went about setting the RAM:FSB ratio, have you done this or do you know how to go about doing it.

if it makes any difference i would like to set the FSB to 240-250, aiming for a 2.4ghz-2.5ghz overclock.

oh and any idea what the difference would be between the 2t and 1t setting? what does it do?

here is my cell menu, as you can see, all settings are set at stock.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v249/steve45/DSC00260.jpg

would also like to know what the HT frequency does.



overclocked my graphics card the other night, some reasonable results, my x800gt(r480 core) now sits at core speed of 550mhz and memory speed of 1100mhz, from 472 and 986 stock, from what i've seen i can push this a fair bit further.

[syadasti]

OCing is so 90s, the hot thing these days is stealth PCs. Heck even Steve Jobs is about performance per watt now ;)

Check out Silent PC Review (http://www.silentpcreview.com), its a great site :thumb:

My PC usually runs around low-mid thirties C CPU temp putting out around mid twenties dB.

System is as follows:

-Asus A8R-MVP Radeon Crossfire/ULI chipset Skt939 DDR ATX Motherboard w/Audio, Gigabit LAN, RAID/SATA II
-AMD Athlon 64 X2 4200+ Dual CoreProcessor Socket 939
-Corsair TWINX2048-3200C2 2GB Kit DDR400 XMS3200 Memory w/Black Heat Spreader
-eVGA GeForce 7800 GT CO PCI Express 256MB GDDR3 Video Card w/HDTV, Dual DVI & VIVO
-Western Digital Raptor 74GB 10000RPM 8MB SATA (main drive)
-Maxtor Enterprise Maxline III 7L300S0 300GB Serial ATA 7200RPM Hard Drive w/16MB Buffer (storage drive)
-Creative Labs Sound Blaster Xfi Music Sound Card
-NEC ND-3540A 16X Double Layer DVD±RW
-Liteon SOHD-16P9S 16X IDE DVD-ROM
-TEAC FD235HFC 1.44MB 3.5in Floppy Disk Drive
-Seasonic S12 430W Power Supply
-Netgear WPN311
-Various USB switches/hubs, scanner, printers, wireless mouse/keyboard, webcam, memorycard reader
-Microsoft Windows XP Pro SP2

Also a Mac Mini 1.42 with 1GB RAM and 80 GB 7200 RPM 8MB enterprise 2.5" HDD

http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b398/syadasti/misc/ainside.jpg

http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b398/syadasti/misc/mwmminside.jpg

http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b398/syadasti/misc/twotowers.jpg

http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b398/syadasti/misc/desktop.jpg

[binary visions]

OCing is so 90s, the hot thing these days is stealth PCs.

I always read SPCR. It is a nice site, but I can't say I care too much about keeping my PC totally silent. It doesn't reside in a main portion of my house so the only time I'm in the room my computer is in, I'm using it.

I will, however, be picking up a new heatsink and 120mm fan eventually to combat the racket of the stock HSF.

Nice machine :thumb:

[syadasti]

I always read SPCR. It is a nice site, but I can't say I care too much about keeping my PC totally silent. It doesn't reside in a main portion of my house so the only time I'm in the room my computer is in, I'm using it.

I will, however, be picking up a new heatsink and 120mm fan eventually to combat the racket of the stock HSF.

Nice machine :thumb:

Well you can get a cooler/quieter AMD HSF for free if you enable "cool and quiet" in the BIOS and you install the AMD CPU driver from their site and the MS hotfix. Some chipsets don't like cool and quiet but it works fine on my machine

http://support.microsoft.com/Default.aspx?id=896256

Edit, you don't have a dual core CPU, so you just need the AMD driver, enable CnQ in BIOS, and set minimal power management for it to work...

[steve45]

p180:drool: :drool: :drool:

thats next on my list.

[syadasti]

p180:drool: :drool: :drool:

thats next on my list.

After using it a while, I think I would rather have the P150, I don't need the full size with all the extra bays and the P150 has the cool HDD suspension system.

[H8R]

Edit, you don't have a dual core CPU, so you just need the AMD driver, enable CnQ in BIOS, and set minimal power management for it to work...

The HSF will still ramp up if the OC is high enough to get the temperatures up. Still, it beats a noisy P4!



The Antec 150 is tits, but not at that insane price. If it came in black w/ out the pre-installed PSU I'd be all over it.

I may try the suspended HDD mount thing in one of the extra 5.25"
drive bays in my case. Looks like two peices of elastic band. No too tricky to pull off. :D

The WD SATA drive I just bought is insane noisy, in fact I think I may have to RMA it - there is a constant low end hum coming out of it that I've never had to deal with on any other drive I've owned. :mumble:

[syadasti]

The HSF will still ramp up if the OC is high enough to get the temperatures up. Still, it beats a noisy P4!

OCing only gives you a small % gain though and shortens component life...

The Antec 150 is tits, but not at that insane price. If it came in black w/ out the pre-installed PSU I'd be all over it.

They showed a black version at the Antec CES booth.

Sell the pre-installed PSU on ebay.

Plus the P150 does not have the bulging door/side panel issue. My P180 has those issues and supposedly Antec is going to send me new panels and doors that don't bulge.

The WD SATA drive I just bought is insane noisy, in fact I think I may have to RMA it - there is a constant low end hum coming out of it that I've never had to deal with on any other drive I've owned. :mumble:

Mine isn't too "loud", but the loudest things on my system are the HDDs and the arctic cooling VGA fan.

[H8R]

OCing only gives you a small % gain though and shortens component life...



:think:

Depends on how far you are pushing it.

I have a 15% OC on my A64 3200+ on stock voltage. Temps never go above 35c. so my fan stays inaudible.

As far as a major OC, (if that's your thing) who cares if you burn out a proc in 5 years instead of like, 10. You wouldn't be using the proc in 10 years anyway.

[binary visions]

OCing only gives you a small % gain though and shortens component life...
That's not necessarily true.

I have a 25% overclock, which is not a small percent gain first of all, and my temperatures are still lower than many stock setups, plus I don't run any extra voltage.

Components aren't going to burn out any faster just because they're crunching numbers faster - what causes burnout is the heat that most overclockers consider a "fact of life".

[syadasti]

You usually have to run the memory timing much looser though and you lose some performance in memory intensive tasks.

Some of the core stepping do OC quite a bit and you get lucky sometimes.

If you have a really stable OC on AMD you can use it with cool and quiet to get extended life (since the speed/voltage is automatically throttled) and lower power consumption with the greater performance on tap.

With decent BIOS you could probably get a speed bump or two in rating without loosing too much memory performance and/or resorting to bus or voltage changes.

[Potroast88]

This may have been posted before, I'm too lazy to search. If not, check it out.
http://www.pistolwimp.com/media/40923/

[steve45]

seen it before, its insane, phase cooled chipset and liquid nitro cpu.
completly pointless and impracticle but cool nonetheless, i'd love to see it benchmarked like that.

gotta love the music:dancing:

[syadasti]

You could just fill your case with cooking oil (http://www.tomshardware.com/2006/01/09/strip_out_the_fans/)

http://images.tomshardware.com/2006/01/09/strip_out_the_fans/aufmacher.jpg

I've seen something like that awhile ago with mineral oil too...

[Pau11y]

I've seen something like that awhile ago with mineral oil too...
Yeah, but I think it was Fluid-Inert that was vapor phase cooled in a fish tank or a keggerator.

Hey Steve, I'll give you an answer here after I get out of class. Sorry I haven't been on the forum much due to homework. But for 2T or 1T, the MSI K4N Neo4s should set that auto. But when you run superfast memory, only in 1 or two (alternating) slots, you can run 1T, else 2T; it's to slow the timing down for dual channels when you're feeding 2 dual channels into the memory bus. For instance, I have 2 stix of 512mb 2-2-2-5 (in alternating slots on the MoBo because they're dual channels) - single dual channel. I can run 1T here. But when I fully populate my mem slots w/ 4 of them (2 dual channels), I have to change it to 2T... almost like (2 dual channel)/2T = (1 dual channel)/T. There is a performance hit tho unlike that equation; 1T is noticably faster. You can let the MoBo auto set this part (at least you can on mine) and it'll go to 2T when I fully populate my memory. When full, if I tried to use 1T, it won't even boot.

[steve45]

ah cheers, that clears that up, i have 1gb(2x512mb sticks dual channel) so if i understood that properly i should be able to run 1T assuming the memory will allow me to?
its auto set to 2T i'll try changing it later see what happens.

[DHS]

yea i did the same thing. i have the 3800+ 64. but on the sli-deluxe board from asus. more sata plugs then anyone could care for. left the memory as it is. but was able to boost it to just under 2.8.
love the sli overclocking bios and software for the 6800 gt sli too

[Pau11y]

yea i did the same thing. i have the 3800+ 64. but on the sli-deluxe board from asus. more sata plugs then anyone could care for. left the memory as it is. but was able to boost it to just under 2.8.
love the sli overclocking bios and software for the 6800 gt sli too

Where did you start from? What's your mem and multiplier settings, VCore and Mem voltage? What kind of cooling?

[blue]

This is what happens when you OC.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=5393904704265757054

I love these guys.

[steve45]

finally got round to working my way round the settings, took some time earlier to fiddle, first round has the CPU at 2.6g (2.2 stock)
HTT 236x11 putting it at about 2606
the memory dosnt seem to like going up past 218-220mhz on the stock timings but thats completely to be expected as its geil value ram, so i knocked it back to the 180mhz setting and is now effectively at 200mhz.
primed for about half hour seemed stable but at that speed i didnt expect any problems anyway.
using an AC freezer 64 pro i'm getting
idle at 28degrees
load at 36degrees

later tonight i'm gonna push it a bit further maybe go for 2.7+ and prime it for a reasonable amount of time.

am i going about this ok? i havnt touched the voltages at the moment, everything seems fine, no problems yet.

[BadRelig1on]

Oo so there is some fellow comp nerds here eeh? well i dont have a good pc anymore but heres a screenshot of my old pc's oc, sold it off to fund a mountainbike.
http://img232.imageshack.us/img232/4654/oc2om.jpg

[binary visions]

am i going about this ok? i havnt touched the voltages at the moment, everything seems fine, no problems yet.
Yep, looks like you were doing everything fine. Didn't see this message when it was originally posted - have you done anything to it since?

You should not need to touch the voltage unless things go unstable.

[steve45]

have you done anything to it since?
yep i now have it up to 2.75ghz, 250x11, completely stable, gets unstable at 2.8 on stock voltage, havnt bothered going any further, havnt really had the time to prime it, but i may have a go at pushing further, when adjusting voltages, what sort of increments should i be goingup at? .05?
its at 1.45 at the moment, so maybe trying it at 1.5v?

[binary visions]

when adjusting voltages, what sort of increments should i be goingup at? .05?
its at 1.45 at the moment, so maybe trying it at 1.5v?
Go up at the smallest voltage increments your motherboard will allow. You should never run more voltage than is absolutely necessary to stabilize your overclock. Upping the voltage is when you start getting into shortening component life and causing overheating problems.

I enjoyed tweaking mine and got a pretty good O/C out of it, but in the end, I bumped the voltage back down to normal and the clock down a few notches to get a stable overclock that I was sure wasn't going to shorten my CPU/motherboard's lifespan.

[steve45]

temps wouldnt really be a problem, i have a freezer 64 pro, which in my sweatbox of a crappy case, keeps core temps at a reasonable 29 idle 36 load, but now i'm thinking i wont bother raising the volts, i'm very happy with the current clock, hell i'm getting 25% more than what i payed for, at the moment i'll just settle for what i have.

[tebstebstebs]

i got my amd 64 venice 3000+ up to 2.6 ghz but it can do more, i just dont feel like pumpin my voltage past 1.4 with a computer that is on/idle a lot. i got a sweet artic cooling 64 freezer to keep it runnin at temps ive seen drop to 19C (depends on room temp lolz)

[steve45]

ach well its been a while since i've been around here.

but anyway since i've been gone i've went conroe.

Intel Core2duo E6600 2.4 with Scythe ninja plus
Corsair 2GB DDR2 XMS2 Dominator PC2-8500C5 TwinX
Asus P5W DH Deluxe
C3D X1900xtx
Antec P180
NEC 20WGX2
Tagan TG580-U15
barracuda 320gb
Audigy2 ZS platinum

my overclock at the moment is going well, had a play about with it last night, from 2.4 stock, its now sitting at 3020mhz each core
still to fiddle about with the ram so its currently underclocked, but i'm not finished with the CPU yet i reckon i could get a lot more out of it hoping 3.2-3.5 stable on stock volts, as soon as i get some watercooling i'll be aiming much higher, so all i've done to the ram is lower the timing from stock 5,5,5,15, now its at 4,4,4,12, thats on the stock recommended 2.1v, but i'll come back to that when i've finished working on the cpu.

i'm utterly astounded by the speed increase i got by going to conroe, even at stock speed, i didnt realise my old A64 3700+ was such a bottleneck.

[binary visions]

i'm utterly astounded by the speed increase i got by going to conroe, even at stock speed, i didnt realise my old A64 3700+ was such a bottleneck.

Dual core is teh win.

[syadasti]

I have my c2d at 30% overclock with stock voltage settings and it idles around low-mid 30C. You can see Intel obviously has headroom in the CPU design and they recently announced 1333 MHz FSB version. I aim for bias towards silent computing over maximum stable OC, the little extra bit I could get in performance I don't really need/care about.

[bullcrew]

Its alive! Runnnnnnnnnnnnn!

[blue]

Cranked my C2D E6750 to 3.2GHZ (stock 2.66), mobo is managing voltage...running at 33C with the crappy Intel fan/sink.

[SkaredShtles]

Cranked my C2D E6750 to 3.2GHZ (stock 2.7), mobo is managing voltage...running at 33C with the crappy Intel fan/sink.
So do you get your photos edited a lot faster? :p

[blue]

So do you get your photos edited alot faster? :p

All of 3ms faster! :busted:

The fanbois don't lie, these C2Ds DO love OCing.

[blue]

Temp issues at 3.6ghz (65C under full load in orthos)...Need an aftermarket cooler.

Stabilizes at 55C @ 3.2ghz under full load in orthos. Not too shabby for the stock sink and fan, though the fact that I have 4 120mm case fans probably helps a lot.

[bullcrew]

61 degrees 3.6 ghz quad 24/7 temps and stability are Prime95 small ftts multi. You will never run your rig that hard..... Mem is at 1600mhz and 8800gts 320mb is at 678/1700/1100.
The CPU has a Coolit freezone Elite and the 8800 is stock cooler.

[H8R]

61 degrees 3.6 ghz quad 24/7 temps and stability are Prime95 small ftts multi. You will never run your rig that hard..... Mem is at 1600mhz and 8800gts 320mb is at 678/1700/1100.
The CPU has a Coolit freezone Elite and the 8800 is stock cooler.

But can you play Minesweeper on it?

[Secret Squirrel]

But can you play Minesweeper on it?

Yes...but the timer moves 8 seconds at a time...

[bullcrew]

Its pong that gives me cr@p. :D

[syadasti]

Its pong that gives me cr@p. :D

See how high it goes with TAT at maximum load:

google link (http://www.overclock.net/downloads/138139-intel-tat.html)

[SkaredShtles]

61 degrees 3.6 ghz quad 24/7 temps and stability are Prime95 small ftts multi. You will never run your rig that hard..... Mem is at 1600mhz and 8800gts 320mb is at 678/1700/1100.
The CPU has a Coolit freezone Elite and the 8800 is stock cooler.
:nerd::nerd::nerd::nerd:

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

[bullcrew]

:nerd::nerd::nerd::nerd:

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

LMAO! I dont fit the part but I love technology and toys.

[blue]

61 degrees 3.6 ghz quad 24/7 temps and stability are Prime95 small ftts multi. You will never run your rig that hard..... Mem is at 1600mhz and 8800gts 320mb is at 678/1700/1100.
The CPU has a Coolit freezone Elite and the 8800 is stock cooler.

The blue lights totally cancel out any speed you could've possibly attained.