did u see Lance's Cross bike on VN ?

[rockracing]

sweet.
http://www.velonews.com/images/report/7399.9943.f.jpg
from velonews.com

[ito]

Drool! That is sexy!

Planet X fork is gorgeous. The bontrage cranks look beefy.

The Ito

[ahbrooks]

I think that's a wound-up fork, no?

[rockracing]

yeah, they say wound up, very nice looking.

http://www.velonews.com/images/report/7399.9942.f.jpg

[genpowell71]

Yeah, nice bike.

Now if we could get him to stop being such a prick in person and give him some personality, we'd have a true champion...

[sanjuro]

yeah, they say wound up, very nice looking.

http://www.velonews.com/images/report/7399.9942.f.jpg

Yeah, that is a Wound-Up fork. If you were to own a Seven, you would recognize it immediately.

The big thing about Wound-Up is it uses an aluminum crown. Most high-end forks today are completely carbon.

It is a much stronger fork, and little chance of screwing up the crown race seat, but it is 100 grams heavier than its competitors. Obviously the best choice for a disc cyclocross bike, though.

[MtnbikeMike]

I like the stem :drool:

[indieboy]

that bike is stupid lolol

[Skookum]

that bike is stupid lolol
NO WAY your stupid!!!

;)

[DHS]

that bike is awsome, i want!

[JMAC]

Yeah, nice bike.

Now if we could get him to stop being such a prick in person and give him some personality, we'd have a true champion...

I second that but there's better for cx bikes.....just ask indie

[Motionboy2]

It is a much stronger fork

I don't know if I would say that. There are some pretty nice forks out there and Wound up relies on some older technology for their forks.
Don't get me wrong, wound up makes some nice stuff, I just don't think I would go saying that it is stronger than the other stuff that is out there.

So did the UCI lift the ban on Disc brakes?

[indieboy]

one: the gearing is road gearing, not cross gearing
two: the disc brakes just don't work on a cross bike or atleast not race bikes. if you want to run them on a trail cross bike, knock yourself out. but you come close to me in a race on a dismount with that rotor spinning at full speed i'm going to have some words with you.
those are my only gripes with the bike. the wound up forks are pretty nice, but i think the alpha Q and the reylonds are a bit nicer and lighter....

[Skookum]

one: the gearing is road gearing, not cross gearing
two: the disc brakes just don't work on a cross bike or atleast not race bikes. if you want to run them on a trail cross bike, knock yourself out. but you come close to me in a race on a dismount with that rotor spinning at full speed i'm going to have some words with you.
those are my only gripes with the bike. the wound up forks are pretty nice, but i think the alpha Q and the reylonds are a bit nicer and lighter....
So what you're still stupid. :D :dancing:

[indieboy]

i never said i wasn't :)

[JMAC]

Aren't disks illegal in cx anyway?.....

[anarchyUK]

$$$$$$$$$$$$

[Zman]

Aren't disks illegal in cx anyway?.....

i actually got the answer to this whole problem before. they are legal now. from someone i truly trust in the industry, and one that has been there for quite a while, it was more that avid didn;t apply to make sure they were legal.......so not technically a ban. just not accepted yet. but yes they are legal

[indieboy]

they were banned, then the ban was lifted. it was just for racing though. but what company is going to put $$ into products that aren't race legal and their riders can't use

[oldfart]

one: the gearing is road gearing, not cross gearing
two: the disc brakes just don't work on a cross bike or atleast not race bikes. but you come close to me in a race on a dismount with that rotor spinning at full speed i'm going to have some words with you.

Why? Surely you don't think the disc is some how going to injure you? I doesn't happen in mountainbike races so what's different in cross which would make a disc dangerous. I mean do you get your fingers in a competitors spinning wheel?

Those discs are heavy though which is a disadvantage in cross. But they are relatively unaffected by mud and water so your braking will be more consistent which allows you to ride faster and safer which is an advantage.

[oldfart]

they were banned, then the ban was lifted. it was just for racing though. but what company is going to put $$ into products that aren't race legal and their riders can't use

No they were not banned. They are not approved because no one has sought approval. That was the UCI response last year.

[JMAC]

Thnc for clearing that bit up for me.

[Buck Fever]

http://www.velonews.com/images/report/7399.9942.f.jpg

My pet peeve - overly complex application in an effort to stick with the "norm". Way too many spacers on that steerer tube. The stem should be flipped and lowered to acheive the same bar height. It's lighter, stiffer and can still be set up to have height adjustment in both directions.

[Arm On Fire]

Agree with above, looks like for some reason they didn't want to cut the steerer.

The spinning disc arguement is ridiculous, what about the whole freakin wheel?
More area to catch a body part in the spinning spoke than the disc rotor.
Sounds to me like you just don't likle disc, smoke screen.

[indieboy]

Why? Surely you don't think the disc is some how going to injure you? I doesn't happen in mountainbike races so what's different in cross which would make a disc dangerous. I mean do you get your fingers in a competitors spinning wheel?

Those discs are heavy though which is a disadvantage in cross. But they are relatively unaffected by mud and water so your braking will be more consistent which allows you to ride faster and safer which is an advantage.

you don't get off and run with your bike at 20+ mph in a cross country mtn bike race like you do in a cx race. bikes are thrown around and whipped over the shoulder so fast that there's no reaction time. wheels have been known to smack ppl and if you've raced in a big cx race you'll know how close some of those guys get to each other.....

[CChase86]

Regardless of how the bikes are swinging around, the disc doesn't stick out any farther than the fork and it's hardly a major protrusion. It's like being afraid of getting chewed by a cassette tooth.

EDIT: Not to mention the edges of disc rotors aren't sharpened to a point anyway. It would take a ton of impact to cause a laceration.

[JMAC]

Regardless of how the bikes are swinging around, the disc doesn't stick out any farther than the fork and it's hardly a major protrusion. It's like being afraid of getting chewed by a cassette tooth.

EDIT: Not to mention the edges of disc rotors aren't sharpened to a point anyway. It would take a ton of impact to cause a laceration.

Dude have u ever touched a disk rotor after some hard breaking? My friend touched mine after a short DH section and he had a huge burn mark....

[CChase86]

Dude have u ever touched a disk rotor after some hard breaking? My friend touched mine after a short DH section and he had a huge burn mark....

Many times. To get to burning temperatures you're going to need to do a lot more braking than you will get in a CX Race. Not to mention my original point that it's kind of out of the way by a lot.

[me89]

kind new to this whole cx race thing but why dismount the bike and fling it over your shoulder. i mean the bikes werent meant to take you threw some supper techy and super rough section and the things climb like mountain goats. so why even bother dismounting. and dude your not going to get hit by a rotor when someone fligs it up in the air. its behind the fork legs and the caliper is flush with them. you are more likely to get hit with the legs befor you get hit with the rotor. quit whining and suck it up lol. and about the spacers its lance guys come on everything is overkill for that man. ohh and about gettting lasserations with a rotor take a look at these bad boys. not done to a point ehh.
gothic rotor (http://www.jensonusa.com/store/product.aspx?i=BR706Z00)

now those are dangerous

[indieboy]

you start off on the wrong foot by saying you're new to it. get another year or two under your belt then come back.
and please learn some grammar........ :/

[JMAC]

I agree, me89 you have no idea what you're rambling on about...

[me89]

okay yeh sorry i guess i was just looking for an explanation. sorry for asking. and obviously some people have a problem with souther peps so ill just go away and never come back to this thread. :nuts: :nuts: lol

[indieboy]

i don't have any problem with southern peeps. i'd be willing to bet my southern heritage well exceeds your own......

[Westy]

i'd be willing to bet my southern heritage well exceeds your own......

Yeah Indie has strong southern heritage, he has only 3 teeth to prove it. :nuts:

j/k :)

[indieboy]

no, but my mom's side of the family has been in the south since the early 1600's and not a single person fought for the union :)

[Westy]

no, but my mom's side of the family has been in the south since the early 1600's and not a single person fought for the union :)

So your saying your family is full of losers? Sorry I can't help myself. You planning on doing any races up north here this year?

[indieboy]

i hadn't honestly looked at all the races i wanted to do yet......odd huh? i've just had my mind on soooooooooooo many other things i hadn't really thought about it. i don't know what will be done mtn bike wise in terms of traveling. i'll travel the southeast but i'm getting an apartment this summer and that will make things hard to travel outside of the carolina's and the true southeast. we'll see what happens, i think i'll be up there a bit for CX. i want to do well with CX and there will be a few UCI races and what not around your area so a few friends and i have made plans to travel around a bit.

[Wumpus]

So did the UCI lift the ban on Disc brakes?


Rules Interpretations > Disk Brakes

Disk brakes are not allowed in UCI events other than mountain bike events. While last year this was an interpretation of the UCI given that disk brakes had never been approved for any races, this year it has been clearly written into the UCI rules that disk brakes are not allowed. Thus, if you are riding cyclocross, you may use disk brakes only if the race is USCF only. For any event on the UCI calendar, if you are in the Elite Men, Elite Women, U23 Men, or Junior Men, and these races were put on the calendar, then you cannot use disk brakes. If the organizer has also included masters events or events for category 3 riders, or juniors below 17 years old, then disk brakes will be allowed.

Be advised that as of January 1st, 2007, UCI rules for bicycles will take effect in all USCF races, so unless the UCI rules change, disk brakes will then not be allowed in any races other than mountain bike.

This Article Published 2004-10-05.

[indieboy]

as it should be

[James]

as it should be
No, that's dumb. There are a lot of pointless, byzantine rules that the UCI has. In my opinion, disc brakes make perfect sense for CX bikes, ridden in super-gnarly conditions, mud, ice, snow, places that a disc brake make all sorts of sense versus cantis.
And the rotors are not *nearly* as dangerous as some of those wheels out there, low spoke-count, bladed wheels, that's a missing finger waiting to happen. It'd be really, really hard to hurt someone with your rotors...
I wonder if they could reduce the rotor diameter for CX bike use, maybe you wouldn't need as much power, like a 4" rotor or something? Didn't Hope used to do that on their Mini brakes for the rear rotor a while back?
Anyway...I kinda rambled, but still...a lot of those UCI rules are stupid.

JJames

[indieboy]

No, that's dumb. There are a lot of pointless, byzantine rules that the UCI has. In my opinion, disc brakes make perfect sense for CX bikes, ridden in super-gnarly conditions, mud, ice, snow, places that a disc brake make all sorts of sense versus cantis.
And the rotors are not *nearly* as dangerous as some of those wheels out there, low spoke-count, bladed wheels, that's a missing finger waiting to happen. It'd be really, really hard to hurt someone with your rotors...
I wonder if they could reduce the rotor diameter for CX bike use, maybe you wouldn't need as much power, like a 4" rotor or something? Didn't Hope used to do that on their Mini brakes for the rear rotor a while back?
Anyway...I kinda rambled, but still...a lot of those UCI rules are stupid.

JJames

there's no need for durability in a cross race. lack of brakes in that sport is not a big issue. oops brakes go out, oh i've got another bike sitting in the pits waiting for me. i mean seriously, durability isn't a huge huge factor in cross concerning braking. the only place where durability is an issue is with shifting and flats. when was the last time you heard having no brakes slowed someone down.....they help but if you have even the slightest power from the NICE canti's ie spookys/empella's than you should be able to slow down slightly if you seriously need to.

[Westy]

there's no need for durability in a cross race. lack of brakes in that sport is not a big issue. oops brakes go out, oh i've got another bike sitting in the pits waiting for me. i mean seriously, durability isn't a huge huge factor in cross concerning braking. the only place where durability is an issue is with shifting and flats. when was the last time you heard having no brakes slowed someone down.....they help but if you have even the slightest power from the NICE canti's ie spookys/empella's than you should be able to slow down slightly if you seriously need to.

Not exactly an orgument against disk brakes, exept to maybe exclude people who can't afford another bike in the pits??

[James]

there's no need for durability in a cross race. lack of brakes in that sport is not a big issue. oops brakes go out, oh i've got another bike sitting in the pits waiting for me. i mean seriously, durability isn't a huge huge factor in cross concerning braking. the only place where durability is an issue is with shifting and flats. when was the last time you heard having no brakes slowed someone down.....they help but if you have even the slightest power from the NICE canti's ie spookys/empella's than you should be able to slow down slightly if you seriously need to.
I realize that durability isn't the biggest concern for the UCI pros out there, they couldn't really care if the bike only lasts 1 or 2 races. And that's fine, same with race cars, motorcycles, etc all get rebuilt after every race.
What I'm saying is that because the UCI "says so" with no real reason besides the fact that they're afraid of new technology, then that effects everyone from the guy doing his first cross race, all the way up to DeClerq. That means that if Joe MTBer wants to give the whole 'cross thing a try, he can't pull out his $1000 disc-equipped hardtail, his only bike, and try. No discs.
It's really a pointless rule. If the DeClerqs of the world want to run the lightest, trickest bike out there, with custom frogleg brakes, that's totally coool, I'll drool over the pics up on Cyclingnews.com all day long, but that means that some people can't run what they want, or they have to get yet another bike to do it.
99% of people racing cross don't have another bike waiting for them in the pits. I'd bet that a good percentage of those people are also riding to work, and riding the trails on their "race" bikes. It's just another example of the UCI not being connected to the average rider.
I liked it better when the USCF would allow them, although I of course realize that you can't have two different governing bodies with two different rules, kinda like NORBA and the UCI.
Same with the World Cup next year, outside assistance is allowed, how many of the big names out there are going to have extra bikes waiting on each lap if they have a problem? And where does that put the privateers, the ones who are maxing out their credit cards and sleeping in their cars, just to get to each race. I'm not sure if NORBA is going to follow the UCI's new regulations, but god, I really, really hope not.
Yet another tangent!
Sorry to write a novel, but I really feel kinda strongly about this...

JJames

[jon cross]

The world cup's new rule is a huge disappointment, but that's a whole 'nother topic.

Disc brakes should be allowed in cross racing. There's no reason not to, as the chance for injury is extremely slight. The rotors are on the left side of the bike anyway, the side facing YOU when you sling the bike. Discs ARE stupid for cross, but we shouldn't need the UCI to take them away. Think about this, you can get some Spooky Carbon brakes that will save a POUND over a disc setup (not even thinking about the heavier hubs) for the price of a good set of disc brakes. A wheelchange with rotors will not be as smooth or quick, as you have to take care not to warp your rotor on the way in. Cross racing is far from technical and the need for heavy braking power is about as common as guys being wounded by another dude's brake rotor. There's a reason that cantis are used, and it's because they are the best tool for the job, not because the UCI won't get with the times.

[Zutroy]

It was the Euro manufactrures that got the ban in place...people like Colnago and the like didn't want to have to mess making disc frames and forks, cause they knew there pros would want them. Contrary to what was said pro do smoke out there brakes sometimes...especially in the really cold sloppy muddy conditions.....i'd take discs anyday over rim brakes even if i had a spare bike to change too.

[JRogers]

Man, this thread is still around?

Seriously, I don't see how someone who rides a cross bike could think that disc brakes are a really good idea. I ride my Empella on roads and trails, in hot summers and freezing winters. I live in VT a good part of the year so if I want to ride, mud is part of the equation. I've never wished for more power or better modulation. The limits of the bike are generally reached well before that becomes a big factor. Plus, cross is all about minimalism and speed. Discs are not needed, so they need to go.

[James]

Man, this thread is still around?

Seriously, I don't see how someone who rides a cross bike could think that disc brakes are a really good idea. I ride my Empella on roads and trails, in hot summers and freezing winters. I live in VT a good part of the year so if I want to ride, mud is part of the equation. I've never wished for more power or better modulation. The limits of the bike are generally reached well before that becomes a big factor. Plus, cross is all about minimalism and speed. Discs are not needed, so they need to go.
I don't think it matters whether you feel that they're useless, or if I think they're the best thing ever, or what. I really think it's fine that people don't see the need for discs, some people do, the issue here is that the UCI has taken the choice away for really no reason at all.
Cantis are much lighter, and in most cases, will work just as well, but for the guy who commutes to work on his "race" bike, can't get a hand-off new bike 3x per lap. It's just lame for lame's sake...

JJames

[indieboy]

hey james,
i'm not trying to be rude, bout could giant please stop making that semicompact crap on a cx bike??? please don't say "well our pros are smoking on it.....". yes, yes they are however, those guys could crush it on a number of bikes.
having the ability to shoulder a cx bike is nice....

[James]

hey james,
i'm not trying to be rude, bout could giant please stop making that semicompact crap on a cx bike??? please don't say "well our pros are smoking on it.....". yes, yes they are however, those guys could crush it on a number of bikes.
having the ability to shoulder a cx bike is nice....
You can be as rude as you want, I don't work for Giant, so...
Haven't in ~6 months or so...
Take it up with them I suppose...:)
I don't really see the use in a CX bike too...Give me a nice steel or Ti frame...

[indieboy]

You can be as rude as you want, I don't work for Giant, so...
Haven't in ~6 months or so...
Take it up with them I suppose...:)
I don't really see the use in a CX bike too...Give me a nice steel or Ti frame...

k i'll go on my rant then. compact geometry for a cx bike simply does not work, at all. no room to shoulder your bike. short headtubes are a bitch too, simply for leverage purposes. sitting down like a road bike on a cx bike throws the handling off.
and are you refering to aluminum for cx bikes? i'm riding a custom steel bike and that's all i've ridden for cx so i can't comment on how an aluminum bike rides. i'll say that my steel cx bike is soooooooooooooooooooo smooth

[jon cross]

The Devo guys riding the Giant cross bikes might have been smokin fast, but they weren't thrilled about the design. There's not a whole lot of credit for good results that can be attributed to a frame design.